RealSurf Surfers' Forum

Posted: **Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:27 pm**

Yep that's right, fingertip drill forces the elbows up, just like in swimming.

Congrats to Paul if he really is using webbed gloves ... I will reiterate my advice to avoid them, they will put unnecessary pressure on the rotator cuff and associated tendons, and also on the elbow, thus creating over-use injuries -- and making 'em worse if you've already got 'em. You'll also lose all feel for the water in the process.

Posted: **Mon Sep 14, 2009 4:50 pm**

So tell me Nicholas, the 'high elbow' routine, which is the thing I have worked on most, works because it changes the amount of rotation in the shoulder joint, (and consequently the load on that point)

Is this correct?

I've been thinking through the mechanics of the new (for me) action and the way my shoulder work has changed, and the best I can come up with is that the shoulder doesn't rotate (as much).

Posted: **Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:04 am**

Well not quite.

You hurt the rotator cuff area when you consistently move the joint under stress. What's really being hurt is the tendon sheaths running through the joint.

They get hurt because of tension in the biceps and forearm -- tension through the arm pulls the tendons tight through the joint, slowly tearing away at the tissues. You end up with persistent tearing, scar tissue blockages etc.

Lifting the elbow transfers the effort load of the paddle stroke from the biceps, triceps and forearm muscles to the big muscles of the middle back. So your arm can remain fairly loose and relaxed, thus reducing the tension through the rotator cuff.

Same goes for keeping the fingers relaxed and slightly spread -- this relieves tension in the forearm and thus in the shoulder.

Posted: **Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:18 pm**

i find all paddling technique goes out the shop window when i've been surfing 3ft beach breaks for an hour and half and i want to paddle over to another bank against a hefty current.

but my style is not great so i'm excited to put this stuff into practice! thanks NC.

i might even buy your book!
my problem with alot of surf books is that they are mostly dated and aimed at learners.

Posted: **Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:20 pm**

My problem with a lot of surf books is that they are WRITTEN by learners...but that's another story

best of luck el rancho! You'll be breezing through the lineup in no time.

Posted: **Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:58 pm**

Posted: **Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:11 am**

Nick Carroll wrote:My problem with a lot of surf books is that they are WRITTEN by learners...but that's another story

best of luck el rancho! You'll be breezing through the lineup in no time.

hey mate had a paddle on sat morning and really consciously tried the elbow lift and relaxed approach. pullling through with my back muscles requires some brain retraining but it felt good, definitely feel less stress on the elbow/shoulder joints, which you dont notice until you change your style.

dunno whether it was my paddling or the fact that it was my first surf without my 3/2 steamer!

cheers Nick

Posted: **Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:04 pm**

Lifting the elbow tip cured my surfing tennis elbow.Thanks.

Also tip of front foot straighter along the stringer has improved back hand 10 fold.Thats a gooden.

Saw a guy wearing strap on sunnies and gloves the other day in 3/4 ft (it was dawn patrol). Next step is putting a cup holder on the board.

Posted: **Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:16 pm**

Posted: **Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:35 pm**

Re: knife - good luck, sounds like the last resort.

Re: front foot down stringer, it opens your body to the wave and hence and gives you a greater perspective, more control, rotation and timing for driving up and wave and ultimately back down. Try it and I bet by the 5-8th wave you are more comfortable.

Its detailed in the book.

Posted: **Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:43 pm**

Posted: **Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:54 pm**

Toby wrote:
Davros wrote:Re: knife - good luck, sounds like the last resort.
10 years or more of dealing with pain was fine, but I have a weakness that could be fixed by surgery. Common ailment, surgical option has a high success rate. I've put it off forever because it's 3 months minimum before heavy exercise (incl. surfing) and 1-2 years before full strength is regained and I don't like downtime. However, I currently perform at less than full strength (or more accurately, full stamina) anyway so I don't have much to lose.

Davros wrote:Re: front foot down stringer, it opens your body to the wave and hence and gives you a greater perspective, more control, rotation and timing for driving up and wave and ultimately back down. Try it and I bet by the 5-8th wave you are more comfortable.

Its detailed in the book.
Yeah, I remember reading about it. I just avoid backhand so I never practised it. The very few occasions I tried I couldn't get my feet into the right spot due to muscle memory and in a fast beachbreak it's all over too quickly. I need a lined up backhand wave to spend some time on the concept. I'm also dubious about pressuring the rails, seems like a good concept for down-the-line manoeuvres but maybe difficult to do big turns. I'm sure NC addresses that, have to dig the book out and re-read.

Didnt realise you had the book.

Re: big turns - view of the wave more set up time, open hips allow you to rotate with more power into the turns.Deadset. Anyway have a crack.

Posted: **Mon Sep 28, 2009 4:10 pm**

Wasn't that different, to put my front foot along the stringer

just amazed to be able to do that.

Posted: **Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:23 pm**

Nick Carroll wrote: I will reiterate my advice to avoid [gloves], they will put unnecessary pressure on the rotator cuff and associated tendons, and also on the elbow, thus creating over-use injuries -- and making 'em worse if you've already got 'em. You'll also lose all feel for the water in the process.

I know what you mean, but buggered if I can get in the water around here without 'em in winter. BTW, can anyone recommend a brand of hard wearing 3mm gloves? Titanium lined?

Fabulous thread. I gotta get myself in the water for a try tomorrow!

Posted: **Mon Oct 12, 2009 2:09 pm**

finally gave this one a go.

i was working most of the weekend, but managed to get out to manly on sunday arvo.

i consciously was trying to lift my elbows, instead of lifting my arms so to speak....

seemed a lot easier, and seemed to paddle around with a fair bit of speed. however it might be my concentrating so hard on my technique that everything seems better

Posted: **Mon Nov 09, 2009 4:31 pm**

Davros wrote:Lifting the elbow tip cured my surfing tennis elbow.Thanks.

Also tip of front foot straighter along the stringer has improved back hand 10 fold.Thats a gooden.

Saw a guy wearing strap on sunnies and gloves the other day in 3/4 ft (it was dawn patrol). Next step is putting a cup holder on the board.

did he have the sharkl deterrent on the back as well, lol

Posted: **Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:48 pm**

Hello,

I think it is working. If you have correct paddling technique then you can get better surf.

Thanks
Paul Brown

Posted: **Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:25 am**

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