local shapers vs big names..

Tribal discussion for shortboarders

Moderators: jimmy, collnarra, PeepeelaPew, Butts, Shari, Forum Moderators

OddaP
barnacle
Posts: 1253
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:32 pm
Location: Mid North Coast

Post by OddaP » Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:07 pm

Hey Daryl, Who is the courier serivce you use for your boards?

And IMO the better question may be custom versus off the peg rather than big name versus local shapers.

I'm sure a big name could make a custom for me just as good as a local shaper if I give them the proper information, ie what I do and don't like, my weight, the waves I will surf and importantly my ability!

User avatar
dUg
barnacle
Posts: 1858
Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:22 am
Location: sitting in my car waiting for someone else to paddle out first

Post by dUg » Fri Jul 04, 2008 7:21 pm

I'll be honest and say I have never owned, from new, a "brand name" board. Had all sorts of them second hand over the years, and they were all pretty "meh", so I decided to shape my own to see how it would go. The first two fell to bits but the third went great. The fourth one got me into and out of bits of the wave I hadn't been in before, and went faster than I'd gone before. Something went "clunk" for me after that.

Having a pet shaper that has seen you surf and knows your strengths and weaknesses ( and in my case, the latter are numerous LOL ) really helps, I think. All the boards he's shaped for me incorporate key aspects of those earlier boards I shaped, but with refinements. He also likes to throw curve balls at me - shaping something I wouldn't necesarily think of - to see how it goes for me. To date, not a single dud... quite the opposite.

I have surfed boards by our two local headlining brands, and while they are both good, well finished products, I've yet to ride on that blows me out of the water - or goes as well as the ones Glen has shaped for me. Ditto a number of Dahlberg, JS and Gunther boards.

And don't get me started on those ZS fish things... geeez....

:P

User avatar
dUg
barnacle
Posts: 1858
Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:22 am
Location: sitting in my car waiting for someone else to paddle out first

Post by dUg » Fri Jul 04, 2008 7:29 pm

daryl wrote:Image

When your shaper moves, you gotta find him in Currumbin.

http://www.darcysurfboards.com/

I like where the logos are placed, like bullseyes for your feet :shock: .
are they K3's in the quad ( front fins )? Geeez... not much tow on them either... how does it turn??

daryl
Huey's Right Hand
Posts: 27145
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 6:23 pm

Post by daryl » Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:22 pm

OddaP wrote:Hey Daryl, Who is the courier serivce you use for your boards?

And IMO the better question may be custom versus off the peg rather than big name versus local shapers.

I'm sure a big name could make a custom for me just as good as a local shaper if I give them the proper information, ie what I do and don't like, my weight, the waves I will surf and importantly my ability!
D'Arcy were going to ship it down for thirty bucks, 'til I went and picked it up.

Yeah, that's about the info Darce asked for, this is a custom same as early years, and I'm very happy with the board.
dUg wrote:
daryl wrote:
When your shaper moves, you gotta find him in Currumbin.

http://www.darcysurfboards.com/

I like where the logos are placed, like bullseyes for willie and nose :shock: .
are they K3's in the quad ( front fins )? Geeez... not much tow on them either... how does it turn??

DHD-2s with a big black star, and I just gave them one try out, so can't answer :oops: They're angled out a fair bit? This dumbarse kook doesn't know what tow is :shock: it flicked around when I first got it. This is one of Daz's babies and is getting third use atm, which isn't any :oops: .

Image
Image

Busy enjoying new D'Arcy :D and the occasional on the Sunova that finally got PG7s only to bust a plug so had switched to boxes, getting to know her the Sunova is a girl :shock: .

User avatar
g_u_m_b_y
barnacle
Posts: 1771
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 6:20 pm
Location: Lennox. Central Coast. Dbah. Raglan.

Post by g_u_m_b_y » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:32 am

salty wrote:When I was in a Surfculture in Bondi Junction a few months ago I asked why they dont sell Gunthers and was told that he doesn't shap for the pros so they weren't interested.

Anyways, as you might have read in another thread, I just got a new custom from Gunther and am bloody stoked to put it mildly.

Back in Surfculture a few days ago and noticed they've now got a bunch of Gunthers (must've heard I was riding 'em :wink: ). But seriously, when I asked why they now had 'em on the racks, the owner told me that Gunther had rung him up and said he was desperate to sell some boards :shock: WTF??!!!! I'm calling bullshit on that :!: I dropped in to Localmotion a few weeks before hand up in Balina and the shaping bay was chokkaz with boards in various stages of production. There was no way Gunther was despo to sell his boards.

:evil:
i think they probably found out that some pros do/have ridden his boards.
why would you buy a board from surf culture anyway?
or is it just the name that makes it sounds like a boutiqe sds?

User avatar
oldman
Snowy McAllister
Posts: 6886
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:11 pm
Location: Probably Maroubra, goddammit!

Post by oldman » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:00 pm

Rockin' Ron wrote: Spot on...

people are sheep
people follow fashion
people are impressionable
people are gullible and vain
people ergo: ride the wrong boards

it's all a farkin guess... and most guess wrong i reckon...
I've largely stayed out of this worthy debate. Ron sums up one point of view beautifully.

But.

Surfers are people
People are also dollar and time poor.
Most surfers will not own, ride or experience enough different surfboard shapes, dimensions and ride those boards in sufficient different conditions, and log all that information to be able to make objective assessments of what is best for them.
Most surfers will have an idea of how they surf but have no way of expressing that as a comparative assessment. Who hasn't told their shaper they are a 'reasonably competent surfer', (compared to what)
Most surfers therefore have to rely on an amalgam of their own ideas, what they find in a shop and what they learn from their shaper if they are going the custom route;

But surf shop owners and surfboard designers are human,
and therefore are just as likely to be sheep, victims of fashion and design 'breakthroughs' that aren't breakthroughs at all.
Surfshop owners are just as gullible, just as vain, just as greedy and oftentimes as ignorant as the poor sheep surfer following the trend.

So there is plenty of truth in what all of you have said.

What hasn't been said is that water flow and hydrodynamics are so intrinsically and unfathomably complex that the best designers and shapers regularly go off in design tangents that don't work.

Factor in the variability of the surfers individual dimensions and skills and it's a crap shoot. We are all working off instinct with varying degrees of levels of feedback. To call the majority of surfers 'sheep' because they choose one of the 95% of surfboards that don't break the mould is uncharitable at best.

The mystery seems to be that most surfboards seem to work for someone. Maybe most of what we think makes a great board is no more than superstition and innate leanings, not that there's anything wrong with that.

Or to put all that in a brief statement; It costs about $600 for each personal experiment in board design, and most of us have only a limited number of $600 investments that we can make in a lifetime.

User avatar
oldman
Snowy McAllister
Posts: 6886
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:11 pm
Location: Probably Maroubra, goddammit!

Post by oldman » Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:14 pm

While I'm here, some have suggested on this thread that shaping for pro surfers enables a shaper to get greater feedback etc, leading to a virtuous loop where the shaper shapes better and better.

I reckon that is a false analogy. I'm sure it works for the pro and the shaper, but my argument is that is has up to no flow on for the average surfer.

Mostly the average surfer is surfing so differently to the pro surfer that the two circles never intersect. What works for a pro is almost certainly something that will NOT work for an average surfer. Surfing is not like formula one racing where technological improvements make their way into production models down the years. This isn't a car where the driver is a minor factor in how the car goes. The surfer is critical.

I thought the 90's was a bit of low point where those stupid wafer thin banana boards were being sold everywhere. You couldn't buy a surfboard with any volume. Good for pro surfers (maybe), crap for everyone else, but that was all that was on offer. Even custom designs regularly came out under foamed, because that was the trend of the time.

Don't talk to me about sheep, baaaaahhhhhhh! humbug.

sean--
barnacle
Posts: 1286
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2005 4:56 pm

Post by sean-- » Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:31 am

oldman wrote:While I'm here, some have suggested on this thread that shaping for pro surfers enables a shaper to get greater feedback etc, leading to a virtuous loop where the shaper shapes better and better.

I reckon that is a false analogy. I'm sure it works for the pro and the shaper, but my argument is that is has up to no flow on for the average surfer.

Mostly the average surfer is surfing so differently to the pro surfer that the two circles never intersect. What works for a pro is almost certainly something that will NOT work for an average surfer. Surfing is not like formula one racing where technological improvements make their way into production models down the years. This isn't a car where the driver is a minor factor in how the car goes. The surfer is critical.

I thought the 90's was a bit of low point where those stupid wafer thin banana boards were being sold everywhere. You couldn't buy a surfboard with any volume. Good for pro surfers (maybe), crap for everyone else, but that was all that was on offer. Even custom designs regularly came out under foamed, because that was the trend of the time.

Don't talk to me about sheep, baaaaahhhhhhh! humbug.
Well said. A few years back a mate lent me and old 80's Aloha to take up the coast for the kids to muck around on. Being a typical board of that era it was flatter, wider and thicker than the boards around now so I took it out and had a ball on it. It's good to see that a lot of board makers can see the market for the older crew. That old Aloha ended up as my nephew's first board and would have been perfect for him had he not wanted a potato chip like his mate had. He got the wafer board and got frustrated with it and ended up on a lid. :(

User avatar
ric_vidal
Snowy McAllister
Posts: 6124
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2004 4:34 pm

Post by ric_vidal » Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:12 pm

sean-- wrote:He got the wafer board and got frustrated with it and ended up on a lid. :(
Tragedy worthy of Shakespeare.

diggerdickson
barnacle
Posts: 2319
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:26 am
Location: home is where the heart is.

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by diggerdickson » Tue Mar 09, 2010 12:15 am

mmm, I havent been surfing long compared to some on this site, only since about 81, I dunno, long enough that Ive forgotten when I started. Over the years Ive had some great boards, my favourites have all been from the mid 80's. A free flight thruster, absolute magic board that one. Some Daniels when he use to be at Thornleigh. Some Crooked River boards from down south and a magic Nirvana. Then the 90's hit and was stuck with crap for a while. found a Dog of a aloha board. Thought I was doing the right thing buying a banana board cause thats what everyone was riding, rode it twice then sold the bloody thing. Went for a Santosha but it paddled shite and I finally learnt my lesson. I was not a pro surfer, couldnt surf those things for shite but I could bury the rail on a thicker wider board and enjoy it more.

The point being that only it took years of surfing for me to wake up for what worked for me. Then I moved to the sunshine coast dribblevile :lol:

Ive now found a sort of local shaper I can trust and hopefully one day I can go surfing with him in decent surf next time so that I can perform and show how I like to surf. I

ve found as I get older (43) Im getting slower but occasionally that magic session happens and it keeps you dreaming of the next one.

I dont trust I can get that sort of service and knowledge from a rack as you can from a local surfer/shaper that knows the conditions you ride in.

I inherently dont trust sales people and maybe thats a Aussie trait I just dont know.

JFor me I just cant go past the smaller guy, as they have more to lose if they dont do a good job and you get better value for money. As the price of boards go up Im forced to get less and less boards, but thats ok I suppose by me as im just really a board slut who wants to buy a new one every 4 months as i want to ride as many different shapes as I can before I turn f*&^%*(I^^ n senile
no, Im not a surfer, Im just a garbage man".

User avatar
oldman
Snowy McAllister
Posts: 6886
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:11 pm
Location: Probably Maroubra, goddammit!

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by oldman » Tue Mar 09, 2010 12:19 pm

Fuck it's funny reading the shite that you wrote 18 months ago, or two years ago.

I can't remember what I was thinking at the time, what mood I was in etc.

It's like reading the work of a stranger, and then looking up to see that I wrote it,

:arrow: :shock: :arrow: :lol:
Lucky Al wrote:You could call your elbows borogoves, and your knees bandersnatches, and go whiffling through the tulgey woods north of narrabeen, burbling as you came.

diggerdickson
barnacle
Posts: 2319
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:26 am
Location: home is where the heart is.

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by diggerdickson » Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:51 pm

hang on, now that I think of it, im already f#$%(*g senile :oops:
no, Im not a surfer, Im just a garbage man".

User avatar
oldman
Snowy McAllister
Posts: 6886
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:11 pm
Location: Probably Maroubra, goddammit!

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by oldman » Tue Mar 09, 2010 3:04 pm

iggy wrote:yes, you did come across all mincey and were rambling on quite a bit..

:D
Just filling the void Iggs.

Probably was wearing boat shoes at the time. :!:
Lucky Al wrote:You could call your elbows borogoves, and your knees bandersnatches, and go whiffling through the tulgey woods north of narrabeen, burbling as you came.

pridmore
Owl status
Posts: 4517
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:38 pm
Location: the white tide pole
Contact:

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by pridmore » Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:51 pm

ha I know exactly what you mean oldman....
and you too Digger.....and you too digger, I think , hang on, I cant remeber, what am I talking about, I cant remember, who are you, oh yeah me too .....who is senile, ?, yeah, thats right me too, I think...WTF ????? :roll: can I make you a board ??? ha ha :roll:

User avatar
Trev
Huey's Right Hand
Posts: 30934
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:11 pm
Location: Any Point Break

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by Trev » Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:30 pm

pridmore wrote:ha I know exactly what you mean oldman....
and you too Digger.....and you too digger, I think , hang on, I cant remeber, what am I talking about, I cant remember, who are you, oh yeah me too .....who is senile, ?, yeah, thats right me too, I think...WTF ????? :roll: can I make you a board ??? ha ha :roll:
Sure you can... I've paid you already :wink:
Beanpole
You aren’t the room Yuke You are just a wonky cafe table with a missing rubber pad on the end of one leg.

Skipper
I still don't buy the "official" narrative about 9/11. Oh sure, it happened, fcuk yeah. But who and why and how I'm, not convinced it was what we've been told.

pridmore
Owl status
Posts: 4517
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:38 pm
Location: the white tide pole
Contact:

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by pridmore » Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:43 pm

no wuckers, ya 5'8" is nearly ready big 'T'...... :wink: :roll:

User avatar
Cpt.Caveman
barnacle
Posts: 1594
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:13 am
Location: Sydney - Everywhere and nowhere.

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by Cpt.Caveman » Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:14 pm

ooh nice, what sort of board are you getting buddy?
Davros wrote:Ego saved - surfing experience rubbish.

mustkillmulloway
Owl status
Posts: 4893
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 9:15 pm
Location: i live in a pineapple under the sea

Re: local shapers vs big names..

Post by mustkillmulloway » Wed Mar 10, 2010 11:57 pm

hey...check out my new bike 8) :arrow:

http://www.bikeexchange.com.au/bikes/sh ... drock-disc

p.s if anyone said i'm off topic....well...vaginas to u :D
reginald wrote:Hang on, now all of a sudden I'm the bad guy. How the try again did that happen?

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 25 guests