FCS advice....

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bookster
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FCS advice....

Post by bookster » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:01 pm

Ok, I've surfed for 20+ years, but for the majority of that time on boards that had fins firmly glassed in place. I got with the times 2 years ago and got myself a channel islands MBM (complete with new fangled FCS thingys and G-AM fins):
Image

I've been riding and enjoying the board for that time without playing with different fin types, but have had friends of mine extolling the benefits of other fins and saying I should try a few. Ok, I thought and checked out the FCS site..... let's just say I have no idea where to start! There appears to be too much to choose from for a fin swappin' noob like myself. This is where you, my fellow shortboarders may be of some help. What do you like and recommend, what should I be looking for in a fin and look to avoid? I'm 5'10" and 74kg wringing wet....

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by bohdidontsurf » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:09 pm

bookster wrote:Ok, I've surfed for 20+ years, but for the majority of that time on boards that had fins firmly glassed in place. I got with the times 2 years ago and got myself a channel islands MBM (complete with new fangled FCS thingys and G-AM fins):
Image

I've been riding and enjoying the board for that time without playing with different fin types, but have had friends of mine extolling the benefits of other fins and saying I should try a few. Ok, I thought and checked out the FCS site..... let's just say I have no idea where to start! There appears to be too much to choose from for a fin swappin' noob like myself. This is where you, my fellow shortboarders may be of some help. What do you like and recommend, what should I be looking for in a fin and look to avoid? I'm 5'10" and 74kg wringing wet....
Just stay with the fins you have, if you cant do the research for yourself there is little point asking anyone else. Fins , like surfing , is a feeling more than anything , and we all like different sensations. I dont mean to be a prick but it really is pointless asking anyone else what they like, find out for yourself what you like. Just borrow a pair that you dont have from a surf shop and see if you like em.

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Post by daryl » Tue Nov 11, 2008 9:55 pm

Different waves, they always are, kind of, different fins. Big one in the middle, that's different. Outside bigger, that's more practical. Try a different design, there are a few, like sharp with a deep inset cut, that, well ask someone, then there are round end ones, I don't know what they're good for. Mix'n'match.

Go some Soar fins, now that you can get them separate :shock: .

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Post by SharkBoy » Tue Nov 11, 2008 10:11 pm

how big is the board? that could help. there is also a pretty big difference between the Am2's and the original AM's

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Post by SAsurfa » Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:01 pm

Your local surf shop should allow you to try fins for free!

Give them a hit and give them a go!

Outside large H-2's with a centre M-5 seem to go well for me :)

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Post by bookster » Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:30 pm

SharkBoy wrote:how big is the board? that could help. there is also a pretty big difference between the Am2's and the original AM's

Yeah, I guess that would have helped- 6' 4" x 18 ¾" x 2 ⅜" Flat up front then double concave through the tail. Good for small to medium sized stuff.

I wasn't trying to get others to do the work for me re research, rather I was hoping to see what fins others regularly used and liked as somewhere to start...

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Post by dudhead » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:57 pm

work from a known starting point
drag out the old boards you have been riding and get an idea of the shape and size of the old fins
find something similar in the fcs range for a trial
be certain you know the board(s)
board design is at least as important

like others i tried many fins before coming back to the allrounder fin shapes
M3 on short boards (6'3" 'ish) - with a G1 centre when REALLY small
M5 on guns
im 80-85kg and 5'11"

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Post by OddaP » Thu Nov 13, 2008 11:31 pm

I'm 5'11 and 80 kgs.

I use K 2.1 on my squash tail 6'2 in the small stuff.

M5 side fins with K2.1 centre fin when the waves are a bit better and bigger on the squash or M5's all round, which provides more a bit more drive.

I have just picked up a Resin8 6'2 round tail and used the M5 and K2.1 centre fin set up in Bali and loved it. This may be my 'good wave" set up although i will also try the M5's this weekend down the south west to get a feel for that as well.

M5's on the 6'8.

I have always felt that the smaller fins (eg the K2.1) freed up the board but the came at the expense of drive, a solution overcome by using M5's with the K2'.1 centre fin.

Reading both of your posts I wonder if i could go down to the M3,s and still get drive, I will have to give it a go

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Post by dudhead » Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:04 pm

i may try the GX
an inside foil M1 would be worth a look also - if it was available

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Post by dUg » Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:56 pm

The board dims, bottom shape and your weight are not enough to make a choice - also need to know what sort of waves you surf, and your style / level.

Anything in the "5" template should suit your weight / board dims, but inside foil polarises opinions in everyone I have spoken to. I also reckon you'd notice a major difference between the Glass Flex AM's you have and the Performance Core version of the same template. I find most of the new glass flex fins with inside foils lack snap and drive - and replacing say, an M3 set with a PC-3 set makes a world of difference. But that's just me.

For starters, I suggest narrow your field to the medium size fins. Then choose a stiffness for your style. Finally, fine tune the template for the type of waves you surf. Anything in the Performance Glass series will give you the closest feel to the glassed on fins you are used to, but they can feel a bit dull in small or low quality waves.

The PC fins are a good middle path I find, and will give you the best all-round preformance.

Ebay is good for picking up lightly used s/h fins ( sometimes unused ) if you want to have a go on something different. Often you can re-sell them on ebay for the same price you paid, and you get to keep them for as long as you like and try them in a broad range of conditions.

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Post by SharkBoy » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:29 am

OddaP wrote:I'm 5'11 and 80 kgs.

I use K 2.1 on my squash tail 6'2 in the small stuff.

M5 side fins with K2.1 centre fin when the waves are a bit better and bigger on the squash or M5's all round, which provides more a bit more drive.

I have just picked up a Resin8 6'2 round tail and used the M5 and K2.1 centre fin set up in Bali and loved it. This may be my 'good wave" set up although i will also try the M5's this weekend down the south west to get a feel for that as well.

M5's on the 6'8.

I have always felt that the smaller fins (eg the K2.1) freed up the board but the came at the expense of drive, a solution overcome by using M5's with the K2'.1 centre fin.

Reading both of your posts I wonder if i could go down to the M3,s and still get drive, I will have to give it a go

just so you know the k2.1 sidefins are larger than the m5's and the back fin is identical to an M3, in fact it is an m3

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by ric_vidal » Tue Dec 30, 2008 4:00 pm

B-ster, if you’re not trying to achieve anything in particular then perhaps best to leave well enough alone.

If you want an introduction to how much difference fins can make, leave the sides in and put in an even smaller rear. You might lose some drive but the board will come round quicker.

If you have the AMs they are supposedly for surfers over 75kg, The AMs are quite raked as well, which is better for drawn out turns so a more upright would mean tighter radius turns. The 5 series fins might be an alternative, M-5, FG-5, PC-5 same specs just different materials/flex. and slightly less raked.

An that would just be a start…

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by dUg » Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:27 pm

salty wrote:(ie. M-series), but it lacked a little bit of drive as well as bite on hollow [sideways] take-offs. Put some M3s in it though (the ones with the honeycomb core) and the difference was noticeable. More drive and bite 8)
That's a very typical situation where I noticed the difference in the cores. The M-series ( placcy ones ) would feel like they sort of "squished" or gave way ever so slightly on those type of takeoffs. Maybe guys that are better surfers than me kinda like that and go with it... but I find it distracts me and makes the board feel unstable in that near-stall scenario. The hex-core ones never seem to do that to me, but oddly, neither do the older TC whitelines which are a slightly different composite.

In my mind I thought the M-3's would have this store/release thing going on, e.g. you'd get a squirt from them in the second half of a turn if you drove them hard in the first half. Instead I just found they seemed to dissipate the energy in the first half and not return it like the Perf. core ones in the same template did.

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by SharkBoy » Fri Jan 02, 2009 9:59 am

is trackiness a reason a lot of surfers like smaller fins in good surf?

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by petelev4 » Sat Feb 14, 2009 10:47 am

From what I have seen, the m3's and m5's have been the most popular but in conjuction with a smaller GX or GL center fin (natural flex) or a PC3 or PC5 center fin (performance core).

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Re:

Post by OddaP » Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:28 pm

salty wrote:Yeh, I'm really liking the inside foil.


OddaP, let us know how you go with the M3.
Have picked up a pair and trying them out, surfed a beachie last week north of here at 3 to 4 ft and they have good drive, maybe a bit looser than M5s, planning on giving them another go tomorrow at Rottnest :D

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by OddaP » Thu May 28, 2009 11:03 am

An update on the fins, I have now ridden the M3's in a range of conditions (from 3 to 4 foot left hand reefbreak to a beachbreak 1 to 4 foot) and on both the squash and round tail 6'2s.

M3s are defintely looser than M5, there is a loss of drive (to be expected). I find them to have more drive than the K2.1 but the K2.1 to be looser still.

After all of this I think the M3s are good in small stuff, I think the K2.1 is a superior fin set up but overall in waves of quality (and most reefbreaks) I prefer the drive of the M5 with a middle fin to loosen it all up-this may be because I have a tendency to overpower the tail a lot (definetely a back foot surfer),which is fine when small but i would rather not slide or feel a need to nurse my board through turns in better waves.

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Re: FCS advice....

Post by Cpt.Caveman » Thu May 28, 2009 12:34 pm

I like to surf off my back foot as well, and I've found that for my 6'3", M5 side fins with an M3 middle fin works well for me. I've surfed that combo in a lot of different sizes and conditions and it seems to work well. M5's all-round felt way too stiff, but I would switch back in more solid waves. If I were to surf my 6'3" on smaller waves as well, I would probably switch them to M3's all-round, purely because the board would feel too stiff for small waves.

My 6' semi-fish has the original composite Kelly fins (K-fin), and they go really well in it. They're a medium sized fin with a shorter rake than usual. I've tried a few different fin combos, and they seem to let the board make some very nice tight arcs compared to the G5 and G3's. They seem to work well with a semi-fish style of board, and still work well when the surf gets a bit bigger too.

This is my understanding of fins, please feel free to correct me:

- Bigger fin = more drive and hold, but stiffer to turn.
- Smaller fin = less drive, looser to turn, easier to release the tail.
- Combinations of sizes = nice to experiment with to avoid the drastic change when you change the size of every fin.
- Shorter rake = more pivoty to turn.
- Longer rake = more drive that guides the board through turns.
- Longer base = more drivey through turns due to more surface area and water resistance propelling you along.
- Different materials for different degrees of flex, whip-back out of turns, and for a different "feeling".

Put all that together and try to find what feel you like for your surfing.
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