Firewire Surfboards

[ric_vidal]

On a different theme, how many of us 'push' our surfboards to their physical limits, even occasionally. I'm thinking it would have to be the very few at the peak of the sport, with the other 99% working way within the limits of the engineering/performance capable in their board.

Discuss!

First you are a bastard Oldman for raising more good points second and more importantly, it is not about pushing a surfboard to its limits, it is about having the best possible surfboard for the individual, irrespective of construction. Each individual is different.

NicknackMaddy’s dad XXXX Carroll can probably rip the bag with one of the doors from my house! You could give me a board with outrigger (training wheels) and I’d still look ordinary.

I want what I want because it works for ME, not to aspire to surf like someone else and, as Nick said, to hopefully keep progressing.

[collnarra]

More ranting from me, previously published elsewhere. I am not quite sure that I agree with myself here.... but anyway.

++++

Noticed that it's become a little uncool to criticise the SurfTech juggernaut? Question why someone needs a cloned board made using quarter century old sailboard technology and you'll be told that you're throw back. That you're standing in the way of progress. That it's both right and just that the board industry gets into this globalisation thing.
But have you ever seen anyone surf better on a cloned Surftech? Of course not. All they've got going for them is some additional durability and, well, the fact that you can have exactly the same board that Taj or Kelly or some other dream-rider endorses. And what value is that? I don't want Kelly's board. And I don't think you do, either.
So why are they taking off? Why are people buying these things when the technology isn't anything new? They're not going to make you surf any better, and they're more expensive than getting a custom built stick from your local shaper. It doesn't make any sense.
Retailers are the easy targets. At my local surf shop the guy that owns the place works on the floor every day. He's a good surfer and between him and his offsiders there's probably a 100 years' worth of surfing knowledge. You'd think they'd be the perfect place to go order a custom board from one of the tens of super-skilled shapers on Sydney's northern beaches.
But their racks are full of Webber and Byrne Surtechs. It's in the margins. The simple mathematics is that a retailer makes more money from a Surftech than a custom board. It's also easier for them to deal with a single supplier – board makers not being the most reliable of people – and if there's a quality hassle, well they just swap over the customer's Surftech under warranty. Try that with your local Hot Diggity brand.
There was a time, not so long ago, that you wouldn't be caught dead surfing your local on board that came from somewhere up or down the coast, let alone an American brand. And at some beaches that's still pretty much the case. Between the Simons, Warners and Chillis the only Surftechs you'll see at Narrabeen are the Saturday morning mal-riders or the internet surfers who have raced down after doing the www thing.
Surftechs generally appeal to surfers that don't have roots in a local beach community. They idea of going down to actually talk to Simon Anderson or Brett Warner about a surfboard – assuming they know that it's even possible – is scary for lots of surfers. They might not know how to articulate what they want, and then there's the delayed satisfaction of having to wait a couple of weeks to see what it is they've got.
Buying a Surftech gives you instant satisfaction and the knowledge that you're might get two or three years out of a board. Maybe that's a good thing. Perhaps Surftech is the arse-kick that the local board industry needs to shake off its complacency and actually figure out how to service customers that don't come from the local beach.
There could be an argument for Surtech if it was a genuinely new, interesting technology or if was something that helped the majority of surfers surf better, more often. But a pop-out (and let's not split hairs) is not the answer to better performance. Working at your surfing is. Understanding your equipment is. Surfing is not tennis, and one size doesn't fit all.
But what worries me most of all (and this is where some people, the high tech crowd) will sneer, is that individualised equipment is part of what being a committed surfer is all about. If we lose that – and we could – then we've lost more than just a bunch of cottage industries. We've also lost part of who we are.

[barstardos]

I think we are just picking up a new subculture withing the subculture.
Paddling around at my local over the weekend on my custom polyester handshaped by a respected local shaper, i Found myself unconsiously sneering at those lesser species riding epoxies.
The new board snobbery starts at hte top with Custom local shortboard -
then other species such as epoxy popout riding blowins are relegated to the bottom of the barrel, just slightly above mini-mal riding backpackers or BMW driving latte-sipping balding middle aged tryhards with longboards and no skills. And at the bottom of the pecking order as always - bodyboarders.

[ric_vidal]

It's in the margins. The simple mathematics is that a retailer makes more money from a Surftech than a custom board.

I’m not too sure about that Col, I saw what I thought was the wholsale price list earlier in the year and they seemed in line with other boards.

But a pop-out (and let's not split hairs) is not the answer to better performance. Working at your surfing is. Understanding your equipment is. Surfing is not tennis, and one size doesn't fit all.

Yes, yes, yes, I’ll have what he’s having!

But what worries me most of all (and this is where some people, the high tech crowd) will sneer, is that individualised equipment is part of what being a committed surfer is all about.

Don’t even think you need to be that committed just have an expectaction and desire, but it does relate to the point above.

[ric_vidal]

The new board snobbery starts at hte top with Custom local shortboard -
then other species such as epoxy popout riding blowins are relegated to the bottom of the barrel, just slightly above mini-mal riding backpackers or BMW driving latte-sipping balding middle aged tryhards with longboards and no skills. And at the bottom of the pecking order as always - bodyboarders.

Good one “fruitos”, wonder if you get any bites? So which brands would you consider to be ‘local’ at Queensie?

[Hawkeye]

I’ll start with you “compounding interest”.

How long's it been since you've been for a surf? You need to go get wet, 'ol mate.

[Nick Carroll]

Paddling around at my local over the weekend on my custom polyester handshaped by a respected local shaper, i Found myself unconsiously sneering at those lesser species riding epoxies.
The new board snobbery starts at hte top with Custom local shortboard -
then other species such as epoxy popout riding blowins are relegated to the bottom of the barrel, just slightly above mini-mal riding backpackers or BMW driving latte-sipping balding middle aged tryhards with longboards and no skills. And at the bottom of the pecking order as always - bodyboarders.

The other unspoken ingredient in board selection: Status Anxiety!!

[ric_vidal]

How long's it been since you've been for a surf? You need to go get wet, 'ol mate.

I can’t talk to you, you’re a subspecies of the genous realsurferoncustomlocalequipment. Dirty vermin, see if you can find a break in the Gulf of Thailand

[PeteW]

These last comments all seem to reflect what is known as herd like behaviour. We people are not individuals we are members of a herd. We, especially the younger ones define ourselves based on how others respond to the little signals we send out. All fathers of wonder children now nod sagely as the MSN flies and text messages ping, knowing this wry smile will turn to anger when the golden child’s mobile phone bill arrives.

Board choice as described by Col and the Queensie bomb thrower reflects herd like behaviour. Status anxiety is due to herd like behaviour. And the big brands know lots about it.

As we age, disgracefully, we become less affected by the herd….sometimes we even recognise that doing what the majority does is or was stupid, think about our misspent youths with groups of mates!! But not all oldies lose this herd like defining of themselves, so they buy BMW 4x4s drink lattes etc.

Which only leaves us with the defiant individualist….Ric. Having abandoned herd like needs to define himself he has clearly begun a path to self actualisation….well at least self something…he might just be an individual.

[Hawkeye]

Which only leaves us with the defiant individualist….Ric. Having abandoned herd like needs to define himself he has clearly begun a path to self actualisation….well at least self something…he might just be an individual.

Reminds me of that scene from Life of Lic er, Brian:

"We're all individuals!"

[ric_vidal]

Which only leaves us with the defiant individualist….Ric. Having abandoned herd like needs to define himself he has clearly begun a path to self actualisation….well at least self something…he might just be an individual.

It’s more a path of self destruction than actualisation Pete, but that is another story

Individualistic, definitely when it comes to surfboards, just very sorry I didn’t come to the realisation much much earlier in my life as I’m convinced my level of surfing enjoyment would have been better. Not that I didn’t enjoy it... well you know what I’m trying to say (where’s Nicknack when I need him)... so why shouldn’t the same be true for everyone else and the construction process in that regard is academic.

I think Col hit on it in some ways with the “understanding your equipment”, but to quote Rich at Pure Surfboards, it is also about how do YOU want to surf.

Reality is I was lucky enough to stumble onto a McCoy board years ago, and in typical McCoy fashion it was a bit different and that in some ways was the start of a journey.

I prefer the term ‘tribe’ mentality Pete, but I have generalised often on RS topics about how most surfers are ‘sheep’. So crazy when you think about it as it is meant to be such an individualistic sporting pursuit.

[ric_vidal]

Reminds me of that scene from Life of Lic er, Brian:

"We're all individuals!"

Back to the gulf with you, vermin!

[Hawkeye]

Misunderstanding.

[oldman]

The other way, well as ye point out, humans work by knitting logic to emotion. ......... In this context, a 3-5% difference in a board's performance is a bigger difference than it first sounds.

Now we're getting somewhere. Ross Gittins has a great article in the SMH today about this very matter. Bugger getting a link for you, look it up yourself. The essence of the article is that emotion wins the argument just about every time, although sometimes it lets rational mind think it got its way, and very occasionally it lets rational man win a small victory.

So I decided I wanted to be a short boarder. Why - emotional decision. After a few boards I had worked out what length of board suited me best and how much volume required, but after that the whole science of hydrodynamics is so complex. So I bought the board that fulfilled the volume and length criteria "that looked like my board". The one that spoke to me in a primal way, that evoked a visceral reaction. The one that looked the fastest (or coolest? status anxiety - even if I can't surf I have a cool looking surfboard)

The only thing unique about it was that I was consciously, rationally, making an emotional decision. It was aesthetic. I let myself fall into the emotion of it all. Besides, who is to say that there isn't any ancient wisdom within your cells that tells you what will glide over water efficiently and what wouldn't. Every gene in every cell is descended from some aquatic creature, assuming evolution is all that science says it is.

Nick comments that a 3% to 5% difference might be quite noticeable. I find that surprising. I think the psychological impact about how you 'feel' about the board is so much greater than the actual performance of the board (and how could performance honestly be measured as it is the knitting of a human,a particular time, a particular mood, a particualr wave and a stick of foam)

What you say is rational Nick, that's probably the greatest weakness in your observation.


Here's a crazy thought. What if the next great leap in design and materials lead to the development of 'the brick'. The newest sensation, it outperforms every water craft ever known to man by 1000%. Hydrodynamic tests prove it works, it's just that it looks like a brick, shaped approximately like a large brick that you paddle. The secret is that it is a new material, and for some unknown reason, only the brick shape works with this new material, but how good is it, and it's cheap too.

Do you think that everyone will be down the beach with their new 'brick' surfboard, or will you stay with something that looks right, even if it doesn't perform as well.

I think I would stay with my current boards, but I'm an emotional guy.

[munch]

RS topics about how most surfers are ‘sheep’. So crazy when you think about it as it is meant to be such an individualistic sporting pursuit.

bahahaha ... ... still ain't done me wave of bah's yet

[ric_vidal]

Rein it in mate, you're going too far. This seems to be going from a bit of banter to something more personal. :?

There is two ways I could react to this, I choose this one:

You don’t know me that well afterall Hawkeye, I have obviously over stepped the mark in your eyes so consider this an open apology!

No offence was intended and I will keep it within the bounds of acceptability. Sometimes it is hard to measure people’s understanding of what is written and would have hoped you had a better handle on my personality. Guess I was wrong.

P.S. Don’t expect me to be all warm and fuzzy about Surftechs though, that’s different and open slaver as far as I’m concerned.

[ric_vidal]

No need to apologise - I misunderstood.

No, no, no, I think every need to apologise, not right that you should think that and a bad example on my behalf. Had to go back twice and correct the spelling and word I missed out I was so p’d off with the situation.

Everyone will know if it ever gets personal from my end, who am I kidding

So Ratboy come on that’s a fairdinkum Surftech model damn I can’t go on you won’t think I’m sincere

Until another day Surftrechy

[Hawkeye]

Here's a crazy thought. What if the next great leap in design and materials lead to the development of 'the brick'. The newest sensation, it outperforms every water craft ever known to man by 1000%. Hydrodynamic tests prove it works, it's just that it looks like a brick, shaped approximately like a large brick that you paddle. The secret is that it is a new material, and for some unknown reason, only the brick shape works with this new material, but how good is it, and it's cheap too.

I reckon if the pros start riding them and win in WCT comps, it won't take long. Won't matter what they look like, "they shall therefore have the official stamp of COOL upon them (or SIIIIICK or RAD or BOGAN or whatever is the trendy teenage word of this present Age of Polyester), and thus they shall sell like hotcakes." (Revelation According to Hawkeye, Chapter 22 v 16 )