Quiver thread

[The Mighty Sunbird]

Well I do like to travel

[batoes]

Always wanted to try a McCoy nugget. Pretty rare to find a second hand 6'0 though. And I'm not much chop on my back foot so they probably wouldn't work for me.... or maybe they'd help fix my heavy front foot.

apparently the potbelly and astron zot are quite front foot friendly. I rode nuggets for a couple of years and they are a really good ride, but back footed. I really should grab one before Geoff finishes up.

[Davros]

Curious about McCoy's. One day

[JET01]

Always wanted to try a McCoy nugget. Pretty rare to find a second hand 6'0 though. And I'm not much chop on my back foot so they probably wouldn't work for me.... or maybe they'd help fix my heavy front foot.

apparently the potbelly and astron zot are quite front foot friendly. I rode nuggets for a couple of years and they are a really good ride, but back footed. I really should grab one before Geoff finishes up.

I guess anything with a tail that wide is going to be.... I got a second hand firewire dominator a few weeks ago. 5'10. I'd had a 6'2 years ago that I sold after not really gelling with it. Not feeling the shorter one either to be honest.

However my 5'11 El fuego... liking it.

[The Mighty Sunbird]

After many years of riding swallow tails, I say the rounded pin is boss.

[crabmeat thompson]

After many years of riding swallow tails, I say the rounded pin is boss.

agreed.

Swallow tails are the ultimate when the waves are small or burgery. Like a MR Twin, in sub 3 foot waves is something else. But, if I had a one board quiver, or had to pick one tail shape to ride for the rest of my life, a rounded pin, would get the chocolates.

[Davros]

Groovy turns on the rounded pin

[channels]

I've been on swallow tails for maybe the last 15 years, can't really remember the last time I wasn't on one. Does the rounded pin make that much difference?

[Davros]

I guess it also depends on the fin set up, love my swallows with quads don't dig so much with tri fin. Round tails I like with tri fins not quads so much. Pretty versitile the round tail as seems you can stick on any board and it go in all conditions. Carves not quick directional changes (swallow acts like two pin tails side my side) But I'll leave to the experts to explain the difference.

There's the more hold in bigger stuff argument but I've seen the odd pro ride a swallow in pretty heavy duty waves e.g. Medina

[Cranked]

I would think the width and curve of the tail would be more important than whether it was a swallow or round.

You could take any round tail and, more or less, cut a swallow into the last few inches.

[crabmeat thompson]

I've been on swallow tails for maybe the last 15 years, can't really remember the last time I wasn't on one. Does the rounded pin make that much difference?

swallows are way more twitchy for me. smooth transition in turns and much better flow from roundtails. i find pins hold more through the tail in hollow waves too as opposed to wanting to skate out from the power with the swallows.

totally depends on the waves you're surfing. on the goldy i couldn't want more than a rounded tail as an all rounder and tube machine.

[steve shearer]

I would think the width and curve of the tail would be more important than whether it was a swallow or round.

.

i think this is true, by and large.

[buddy]

Byrning Spears standard channel bottoms are swallows and they go amazing in tubes and open faces.

[Nick Carroll]

jeez ok

Look, it's all in the outline curve.

A swallowtail's outline curve ends two or more inches out from the board's centre line. This changes the outline curve, basically straightens it out a bit. The last two feet or so, very much straighter. The basic effect is to preserve some width in the back end of the board. But (and this is a subtle thing so brace yourselves) because the release along the outline is straighter, the turn will be more defined, but less flexible. Swallows are a lot like straight up squaretails in this regard. The break in the outline is hard, thus the turns are pretty basic.

There's a couple of other effects. Because of the way fins are set, the fin cluster's effect in a swallowtail is a bit further away from the end point of the board's outline than in a squash tail or round pin. So the board feels a bit looser than it actually is. (Cue crabmeat's sense of his MR twin.)

And because of the disruption in the board's centre line end point (the stringer end being up from the rail end), the effects of rocker are diffused. Maybe that's why a lot of swallowtail boards have a pretty flat rocker. (This is why you won't see too many top pros riding swallows, they are focused on surfing off the rocker curve, not the outline curve, and the swallow's outline curve is too restrictive for them.)

A round pin's outline curve ends at the stringer. This creates a full outline curve, bringing some drag into the outline but allowing a more subtle and softer feel in turns. The turn is less defined, but more flexible. The curve also connects more naturally with the rocker, which is what you saw happening with JJF's turns at Margaret River; riding straight off the rocker curve, but with the rest of the board totally in tune with that curve, not operating at slight odds to it, the way the swallow does and the squash tail can sometimes do.

The one thing a lot of pretty normal surfers probably dig in the swallow is the way it preserves area and thus flotation in the back end, while also allowing you to feel a lot about what's going on back there via the complex water flow around the tips of the swallow.

I think swallows are killer in tow boards. Those boards need straight lines and straight but very subtly curved rockers, and they don't need a round pin's drag.

[Cranked]

Well there you go.

And it all made complete sense to me.

[JET01]

Took the 5'11 El fuego out again today out at dropping tide voodoo rights. No wind. MRTFX fins with small trailer. Really noticed the more pivotty feel of the bigger fins. Did a few really nice turns (for my level) and found i was able to pivot off the bottom a little easier on the steeper ones. It was like a knife through butter out on the open face.
Main difference I felt from my usual round tail boards was the sharper direction changes. I haven't felt that before. Probably my imagination, but it definitely felt different to my Sweet spot 2.0 and the PCC 6'0 i just traded for a newy.
I had a 6'2 M10 Hogfish Tuflite years ago when i was coming down from a mini mal with a similar fin futures fin set up. I've been regretting selling it for years as I had a few magic sessions on it but got carried away experimenting. Havent' seen one for sale since, but this board is the closest thing I've been able to find. A keeper.
Might try it as a quad, but at the moment I can't really see much point. I haven't ridden a super twin setup since so I'm thinking my style of surfing suits that fin set up.

[JET01]

I really appreciate the time you put into your posts Nick. Thank you.

[Davros]

Nick Carroll said:

"The one thing a lot of pretty normal surfers probably dig in the swallow is the way it preserves area and thus flotation in the back end, while also allowing you to feel a lot about what's going on back there via the complex water flow around the tips of the swallow."

Penny drop moment. Cheers for that.