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Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:41 pm
by steve shearer
Nah mate.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:50 pm
by steve shearer
A, I reject the notion surfing is uniquely predisposed to producing selfish narcissists and it may even have a counter vailing effect over a lifetime and b: I reject the notion that surfing is purely self indulgent. It has a very strong utilitarian element which has both easily observed subjective parameters and easily quantifiable objective parameters.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:01 pm
by Nick Carroll
I would add c) surfing is still growing and developing as a culture here in Australia and in most other places around the world, just because for a while the Aussie surf culture looked pretty adolescent etc does not mean it is now or will be in the future. I think Fiona is remembering something that's no longer quite true.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:05 pm
by foamy
Though surfing is play so will always happily retain something of the child.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:11 pm
by steve shearer
But somehow conflating that with racism, sexism etc etc is just bullshitt logic.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:12 pm
by No Pants Lance
steve shearer wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:50 pm
A, I reject the notion surfing is uniquely predisposed to producing selfish narcissists and it may even have a counter vailing effect over a lifetime and b: I reject the notion that surfing is purely self indulgent. It has a very strong utilitarian element which has both easily observed subjective parameters and easily quantifiable objective parameters.
Nothing, absolutely nothing beats curling up with Derrida on a rainy Saturday.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:19 pm
by foamy
steve shearer wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:11 pm
But somehow conflating that with racism, sexism etc etc is just bullshitt logic.
I didn't agree with that. Those isms do not seem innately adolescent.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:20 pm
by steve shearer
I know you didn't Foamy, it was Fiona Capp who made those causal connections.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:24 pm
by steve shearer
And this premise of toxic masculinity that Tim Winton seems in thrall to.
It ruins his fiction, makes it overwrought and inauthentic. Especially in the case of Breath. Last third of that book was a mess.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:53 pm
by steve shearer
Just can't get my head around Derrida Skip. Had a few cracks at it. Foucault makes more sense to me.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:13 pm
by black duck
steve shearer wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:24 pm
And this premise of toxic masculinity that Tim Winton seems in thrall to.
It ruins his fiction, makes it overwrought and inauthentic. Especially in the case of Breath. Last third of that book was a mess.
The last third of nearly all his books are a mess.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:21 pm
by 2nd Reef
black duck wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:13 pm

The last third of nearly all his books are a mess.
Agree.

I went and saw the premiere the other night and had pre-judged it a stinker because of that, but instead I came away all lightheaded and enthused. Wasn't a great fan of the book, Winton can often lead you into unlikely scenarios yet somehow convince you of their possibility, it's a strength of his storytelling, however the asphyxiation sex bit was like a malignant tumour on an otherwise fine specimen and I couldn't suspend disbelief. Fortunately Baker tones it down, so while there's still a plastic bag under the bed, it's more representative of adult sex in general, dangerous to an emotionally vulnerable teenager, and the analogous aspect of risk taking that the book turns on.

I knew no-one like Pikelet when I was a grom, a surf-crazed teen that had the fortitude to say no to a revered mentor, and I doubt many exist. So Pikelet saying no to Sando is one of those unlikely scenarios Winton manages to present with conviction. And it worked, at least on film. It may come off as moralising viewed in context with his recent toxic masculinity campaign but it didn't feel like that in the darkness of the cinema. Others may judge that differently.

Of course, it ain't just the ideas that we'll judge, there's also the visual presentation. Do we again look like dills up on the big screen? To this at least, I reckon every surfer will agree that Baker nails it. The surfing quirks aren't explained, he doesn't try to make the surf look 50 foot, there's no climactic big wave scene, no pseudo mysticism. Every actor surfed and so did the writer, director, and the whole water unit too.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:38 pm
by ctd
black duck wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:13 pm

The last third of nearly all his books are a mess.
Probably good that it was changed for the film

Nick, still not a fan of dolphins?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BiGQE-vHbOH ... =kookslams

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:27 pm
by steve shearer
Baker is no kook. Lennox boy.

And knowing what I know about that teenage risk taking did him no harm at all.

I think Winton has really tied himself in a knot and got the premise arse about.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:37 pm
by Nick Carroll
ctd wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 3:38 pm
Nick, still not a fan of dolphins?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BiGQE-vHbOH ... =kookslams
I take it all back

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:37 pm
by 2nd Reef
Maybe...one part of me was thinking 'What's wrong with stretching yourself?' It can even be an ongoing lifelong situation, yet Pikelet reached his limits in teeangehood.

But then there's also something to be said about going against the prevailing pressures, and I guess Winton says it.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:43 pm
by the prawn
That dolphin slam rocks.

Re: Just general surfing stuff

Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:07 pm
by Thud
Best thing Ive seen for a time