Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

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Animal_Chin
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Animal_Chin » Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:08 pm

Here we go again with Crutchman pushing his wobbly wheelbarrow full of opinions on other people. :~

Why are you concerned about people riding short boards? Every farkin post from you is the same inane drivel about people riding boards that YOU think are too short.

You like mini-mals, I get it. For the love of Allah get over it.







**sits back and awaits predictable Hypto comment** <:
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by pirate_agenda » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:11 pm

steve shearer wrote:
Volume has become a bit of a touchstone for surfers, in the sense that you find the "correct" volume for how you surf and then you stick with that, through shortboards, guns etc etc.

I've always called total bullshitt on that .....you want a range of volumes in your quiver depending on what conditions you are intending them for.

This constriction of surfboard dimension according to a correct volume is just caca thinking.
I normally think of the "ideal number" is for your good wave board volume - ie something that will work in 3-6ft waves. Adjust the volume up a bit for groveller, up a bit, or even with a stretched and foiled template for step up, up more for mini gun etc.

Beerfan

Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Beerfan » Thu Jul 17, 2014 6:05 am

Animal_Chin wrote:Here we go again with Crutchman pushing his wobbly wheelbarrow full of opinions on other people. :~

Why are you concerned about people riding short boards? Every farkin post from you is the same inane drivel about people riding boards that YOU think are too short.

You like mini-mals, I get it. For the love of Allah get over it.







**sits back and awaits predictable Hypto comment** <:
Mate, this is getting stale, come up with a new attention seeking thing

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Hatchnam
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Hatchnam » Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:05 am

Beery. Just put him on block. I have now.
Moreover because of his mindlessly unfunny gifs, than anything he says or thinks about me, or otherwise. I couldnt care less about that.
I suspect he's pretty young and hasn't even got a step-up let alone a proper gun for that matter.
Whereas I probably bought my first gun before he was born.
He'd be more into ovaltine, putting surfing stickers on his car, and doing chop hops in 2foot slop than setting himself up with anything sensible for winter swells.
Sniff wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:39 am
Not enough for a full handbeak
steve shearer wrote:full dionysian hand jive body torque

Elmako
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Elmako » Thu Jul 17, 2014 10:36 am

Have had many experinces with this over the years, my last experience with this was over Easter, the day after the bigger day at Crescent Head beach break, I took a 6'8 semi gun on a 6 foot day which I could have easily surfed on my step up 6'4. Because of this I was able to catch most of the set/better waves and connect sections that otherwise I would have struggled with a shorter rail and sat a few meters deeper and out than the crew on std shorter boards , it felt great.

However I do have to say that when the sections slowed down and the open face was ahead I would have prefered to be on a shorter board, so for me it is a bit of a trade off, you get better set waves with a proper semi-gun however you do sacrifice maneuverability on the open face. I did use smaller fins so this helped with throwing the board around. It is definitely an exercise worth doing more often than not, my set wave count was way up.

Also on the biggest day @ 8 foot (the day before), me and another bloke were the only ones catching some of the best waves amongst a ton of closeouts (he was on a 7'2). I say you gotta have a proper semi gun in your quiver and yes this ideally will have more volume than your 3-4 foot wave weapon. How much it will depend on the waves and your skills.

Not too long ago I saw something on Surfline about Jamie O'Briens (JOB) Tokoros boards for pipe and the boards when up in volume considerably according to surf size, for example he had:

29 Liter for 3-4foot waves
32 liters for 6-8
36 liters for 8-10
38 to 40 liters for 10+

Volume does give you a good indication for all around boards but you will have to consider other aspects like rocker and rails.

Also the semi-gun is great for surf trips as you can use for crowd controller purpose, a couple years ago we got skunked with bad winds on the Mentawis and we could only surf Nipusis for a couple of days, 3 boats and 30+ surfers..... I had a 6'10 and sat way at the back getting most of the set waves before anyone could paddle onto them.


cheers

J

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el rancho
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by el rancho » Thu Jul 17, 2014 10:50 am

Elmako wrote: Also the semi-gun is great for surf trips as you can use for crowd controller purpose, a couple years ago we got skunked with bad winds on the Mentawis and we could only surf Nipusis for a couple of days, 3 boats and 30+ surfers..... I had a 6'10 and sat way at the back getting most of the set waves before anyone could paddle onto them.


cheers

J

you must have gone down a real hit.

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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Hatchnam » Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:17 pm

Elmako wrote:....Because of this I was able to catch most of the set/better waves and connect sections that otherwise I would have struggled with a shorter rail and sat a few meters deeper and out than the crew on std shorter boards , it felt great.....However I do have to say that when the sections slowed down and the open face was ahead I would have prefered to be on a shorter board, so for me it is a bit of a trade off, you get better set waves with a proper semi-gun however you do sacrifice maneuverability on the open face....
that's the catch22. the trade off between bagging as many as possible and then best attacking the ones you nab. for mine, i love the length of rail and the longer-arc projection it provides vs. higher maneuverability. happy to cruise and grind out through longer turns and arcs in bigger stuff.

again, it begs the question as to 'why' there hasn't been a whole body of work dedicated to creating winter-gun type boards that focuses strictly on "bagging the maximum number of waves AND blasting them to pieces". as at this stage, shapers seem to focus on one or the other, but not both. as again, by and large shapers simply don't seem to focusing on winter guns. just the indo-step up stuff.

maybe for winter-swell guns, it's more of a reactive process for them (ask for one, and we'll shape you one, but we're not going to focus on it, because the market's not there for them)? again, more chicken-and-egg stuff. if they DID pro-actively focus on building the ideal board for big winter swells, and marketing them (well), then maybe it'd take on more? the demand and market should be there for it, and seems pretty fkn untapped at the moment

surfers are like sheep after all. if you tell what's good for them and make it sound sexy then watch 'em gobble it up..!
Sniff wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:39 am
Not enough for a full handbeak
steve shearer wrote:full dionysian hand jive body torque

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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Nick Carroll » Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:27 pm

hey hatchiggy, I'm not bagging you a la animal chin here but you know, they're not all sheep etc, they may have different experiences to you, you don't have to define your surfing against lesser surfers all the time mate. Like there are a shit load of surfers better than you in a wide range of conditions, and they may not be riding the same boards you are either.

leave 'em alone, you've got good advice to give, you don't need to slag off at other surfers in order to give it.

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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Hatchnam » Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:50 pm

Nick Carroll wrote:hey hatchiggy, I'm not bagging you a la animal chin here but you know, they're not all sheep etc, they may have different experiences to you, you don't have to define your surfing against lesser surfers all the time mate. Like there are a shit load of surfers better than you in a wide range of conditions, and they may not be riding the same boards you are either.

leave 'em alone, you've got good advice to give, you don't need to slag off at other surfers in order to give it.
Hi Nick,
That last sentence probably came off sounding a little snide and one dimensional. But to clarify, I'm Not excluding myself from the sheep equation here. Marketings a powerful tool and every surfer or otherwise is guilty of being influenced or controlled by it. I just see a huge gap that looks untapped and question why it exists? Shit, if there was a whole plethora of sexy winter-swell type boards being marketed out there in the mix, I'd be right in there hook line and sinker because i love it. But instead, without a shaper/marketing focus on it, it's more down to personal trial and error to find out what works and why.

And certainly aware of my ability and how that stacks up above and below everyone else. Intermediate but consistent is about where it's at for me. I'm happy take this piss out of myself and own abilities, and often have.

Again, this threads not a slagging match. Or wasn't created with that intent, as it's an observation, and question, and forum to discuss the topic, that's all.
Sniff wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:39 am
Not enough for a full handbeak
steve shearer wrote:full dionysian hand jive body torque

Slobadan Madicubich
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Slobadan Madicubich » Thu Jul 17, 2014 1:12 pm

Hatchnam wrote:
Nick Carroll wrote:hey hatchiggy, I'm not bagging you a la animal chin here but you know, they're not all sheep etc, they may have different experiences to you, you don't have to define your surfing against lesser surfers all the time mate. Like there are a shit load of surfers better than you in a wide range of conditions, and they may not be riding the same boards you are either.

leave 'em alone, you've got good advice to give, you don't need to slag off at other surfers in order to give it.
Hi Nick,
That last sentence probably came off sounding a little snide and one dimensional. But to clarify, I'm Not excluding myself from the sheep equation here. Marketings a powerful tool and every surfer or otherwise is guilty of being influenced or controlled by it. I just see a huge gap that looks untapped and question why it exists? Shit, if there was a whole plethora of sexy winter-swell type boards being marketed out there in the mix, I'd be right in there hook line and sinker because i love it. But instead, without a shaper/marketing focus on it, it's more down to personal trial and error to find out what works and why.

And certainly aware of my ability and how that stacks up above and below everyone else. Intermediate but consistent is about where it's at for me. I'm happy take this piss out of myself and own abilities, and often have.

Again, this threads not a slagging match. Or wasn't created with that intent, as it's an observation, and question, and forum to discuss the topic, that's all.
Hold your ground hatchnam, for your highhorse is indeed a mighty fine steed from which I imagine you'd be able to look Andy1234 in the eye as he sits astride his pennyfarthing, both of you lording over us all

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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Hatchnam » Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:28 pm

^ do u have anything of merit to discuss re: winter guns? or are you just tomtom reincarnated ?
Sniff wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:39 am
Not enough for a full handbeak
steve shearer wrote:full dionysian hand jive body torque

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el rancho
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by el rancho » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:04 pm

I have a 70s flyer swallow-tail singlefin shaped by the late mickey mac, 6'10 and a shade under 20 inches wide. dunno if you'd call it a semi-gun, it has a narrow gun shaped tail though. bought it from bylesy's couple years ago

I'll take it out if this mondo swell materialises this weekend.


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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Natho » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:17 pm

I think you will find the reason many board companies don't put a lot of focus on marketing 'winter guns' is because they make up such a small percentage of overall board sales. Lets face it how many of the surfing population will surf when it is more than say double overhead needing a 'winter gun'?. How often does it get that big anyway?.

Biggest board I have in my quiver at the moment is 6'4 which is 5 inches longer than my shorty. Not exactly a 'gun'. Its my favourite board to ride but I'm lucky to surf it three times a year.

A shaper mate is wanting to shape me a 6'8 or 7'0 right now. After thinking about it I've decided at least here in Sydney the board would hardly get ridden. I would rather allocate that space to a shorty that I know I will ride a plenty. I think the average punter is going to be the same as lets face it boards are not cheap. Many shapers you will find love to shape those types of boards. Its a bit of a change compared to all the small wave boards they do I guess.

On another note I recently I did a trip up the coast. I looked at the forecasts and was expecting 4-5 foot max. It ended up being pumping 6-8 foot and the biggest board I had was 5'11. The 5'11 worked fairly well to be honest however I came away from the trip kicking myself I did not have a few extra inches with me. The extra length of rail would have meant I did not have to keep 'nursing' the board through turns and could have made more sections. The sessions probably would have gone from awesome to epic. The guys on longer boards were also able to sit out further while I had to sit a bit more inside (and cop more on the head).

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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Hatchnam » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:17 pm

ER.
how thick is that thing? hard to tell from the pics, but the rails and foil look kinda refined for a 70's stick?
could be a good point and shoot rip-paddler for big mushy fingal causeway. :wink:
Sniff wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:39 am
Not enough for a full handbeak
steve shearer wrote:full dionysian hand jive body torque

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el rancho
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by el rancho » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:30 pm

thick as fuck, and down rail all the way

had a few sessions there last couple weeks, maybe a bit over head high, it's a wild take-off at the moment, backwashy and big heaving sections.
actually I took my longboard down there this morning, the waves were sort of fun, probably good by california standards. anyways, this huge pack of baitfish makes its way from up the beach, south to the causeway, gannets dive-bombing and seagulls flying everywhere. Eventually I find myself floating directly above this huge school the size of a basketball court, all I can see is a black writhing mass below me, the fish aren't even noticing I'm there. I caught a wave directly over the pack, cutting a path through the scattering gulls.

eventually I trek back up to my car and this guy and his son stop me and ask how it was. he then tells me his son was bodysurfing on dusk around the corner at dreamtime yesterday and they saw a tiger shark.
Last edited by el rancho on Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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spork
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by spork » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:32 pm

Yeah Natho, the last time it was big enough for a gun here was 2010, that's a long time for a board to sit in the rafters.
When it gets to this level of self important stupidity I lose interest.
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by Trev » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:37 pm

Mine's ready. But I'm probably not. :oops:
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Re: Winter Guns... Wherefore art thou ..?

Post by el rancho » Thu Jul 17, 2014 4:42 pm

nice trev.

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