Andy Irons Dies

[crabmeat thompson]

Your assumption that they are super fit, may not always be true either.

Dane reynolds needed to go on a drip to surf Trestles.

Now, that is not super fit.

I don't understand on one hand, how the ASP and big surf companies want the tour to have credibility and to be on the map as a global, marketable sport.

... if they want to be a big name sport and credible, should they not abide by the big name sports rules. ie random and prolific recreation and enhancing drug tests?

[alakaboo]

I used to subscribe to Outside. Seems to be the only outdoor sport magazine that has stories that aren't either ads for some product or a boring description of a trip along the lines of "we hiked like, forevs, and then we shredded some gnar. rabs and gino showed mad steez"
Might have to renew the subscription.

[oldman]

Ah fark, I'm not going over that old ground Steve. Go back and read my boring as bat shit posts.

Again, I can't agree that having more energy, apropos coke, coffee or whatever is going to make a pro surfer a better surfer.

I can't even get a substantial argument here on the field I have set up.

All I can get is this

Olds, there are a few drugs on the performance enhancing side, as well as little old rec drugs like cocaine which have been used to enhance performance by pro surfers.

From you of all people Shearer. Surfing apparently enhanced by having more energy and an over-stimulated brain.

Balance, judgement, timing, flow, competitive nous, they are irrelevant.

Is that it?

Please describe to me the drugs that enhance your actual timing, balance, judgement and competitive instincts.

Na, don't worry, I have already got the answer from 18 different people, all saying "yes, there are performance enhancing drugs."

No argument, no story to tell. No studies (which all tell us that the brain is far too complex)

Nup, just "heaps more energy, make pros better surfers."

It's been stimulating.

[steve shearer]

Olds, I don't really have the time right now.
But it has been done, it will be done again.

And general stimulants like caffeine and cocaine have been used to enhance performance in surfing.

There's a shiteload of material out there which details the affects on the brain.

It's fairly easy logic to see how improved cognitive performance, alertness, etc etc can be used in surfing.

[localbogan]

Olds, go back and have a quick read of my last post.
Human growth hormone would be perfect for a surfer.

[Nick Carroll]

Braithy the ASP has had a drugs policy for many years based on the WADA banned drugs list, but the organisation (pause for amazed gasp) has never taken responsibility for conducting the actual tests. That has been left to the discretion of regional offices and individual events. As you can imagine, this has limited the drug testing to less than a handful of events in the past 10 years: some events in France, which were being held with the aid of the French Government and thus had to do the testing by law, and the Margaret River event when it was Drug Aware.

Two surfers have been exposed as using illegal drugs under this wonky system. One was Neco Padaratz who received a 12 month ban from competition. The other, whom the ASP will not name, was caught for a recreational type drug and hit with a penalty that has not been made public.

The ASP is currently in the process of applying for signatory status with WADA which involves setting up a proper WADA-approved drug testing regime. This should be up and running in 2012. It will probably be a bit like the ISA's system in which all finalists and random other competitors are tested both in and out of competition. Yep that's right, the amateur organisation is about a decade ahead of the pro one in this regard. (Probably because the ISA wants to be in the Olympics.)

WADA's banned drugs list includes everything recreational as well as scientific -- except for alcohol -- you can test for that under their protocol but you don't have to.

I'm hoping that everyone who interviews Brodie Carr from now on will ask him about the status of this application, all the way until it is actually done and dusted. Because it's the sort of thing that might just go away otherwise.

B-Rad did good. Yeah he scooped me with the Billabong guys, but who cares, it doesn't matter who writes it, as long as it keeps getting written. Hoo rah.

[Nick Carroll]

steve and olds, I have used illicit recreational drugs in major surf competition and they do not help one little bit.

They might enhance a fun surf but competition is a different matter, there's enough going on without artificial mood alteration.

Caffeine makes your hands sweaty, marijuana causes you to doubt your judgement, and cocaine, well all you want to do is go back in and have some more.

[daryl]

Sorry bout the sloppy cut n paste. I'm at work on the phone.

As far as the number of surfers who use substances on the banned list, I am willing to bet it is way higher than 1 in 10.

So would I, hence my questioning of your use of the word 'decimate'.

Just being cheeky.

Rather than try to refute the obviously well made points of yourself and others re physiological aspects of drug taking, my original point was this, and I stand by it;


- if you have two or 3 obviously fit athletes engaging in such a whole of being sport as surfing, do you really think a bit of extra energy is actually gonna make the difference?

Yes. It's not just about extra energy. It's about the whole mind/body stimulation. So Generally speaking, anyone with the skill and abilities of a pro surfer is more than likely gonna find themselves pulling off moves they didn't imagine they could. The Al case aside, as some might disagree that it was a contributing factor in his performance.

Especially where tactics, flow, balance, awareness, co-ordination and reading of the ocean are likely to be much much much greater determinants of heat events than energy levels?

Where contestants are towed out the back, thus virtually eliminating fitness and energy levels as a vital component?

I think it's irrelevent about the tows. Their performance on a wave is what counts. And the effects of a stimulant will only benefit that performance.

And your telling me that speed or coke is going to improve your surfing ability as a pro?

As above.

Are there really drugs that improve your balance? Really?

Yes. By it's very nature Cocaine acts as both nervous system and brain activity stimulant. And thus 'enhancing' awareness and motor activity. You can't argue that these two factors are not crucial to a pro surfer's performance.

Drugs for bipolar - performance enhancing? Depends - how good do you surf when you are so low that you can't even get out of bed, as opposed to feeling bloated, tired, etc but still able to paddle out. The guy who paddles out is going to be a better chance of being out there. That has got to enhance his chances of winning, even if he feels shite.

There's no 'depends, and no question. The debilitating aspects of bipolar could easily, albeit temporarily, be alleviated with stimulants such as coke and speed. But in relation to Irons , Puerto Rico was a case of him feeling shite we've been led to believe. So nothing would have helped him perform inthat instance.

The term 'performance enhancing' is dependent in initial conditions, which are assumed, but cannot be. There is a lot more grey in it then people are suggesting.

And some grey there too Olds. Not sure what you're trying to say. But it is dependent on the individual's tolerance or intolerance of a particular stimulant.

from what I could understand ^, there it is. So decided to sacrifice self as the guinea pig to prove it. Went out and was playing around all day, missing everything as usual for lack of, no, for being lazy and not going back in and rocking off again, thing is, had it all figured out, big picture and all. There was the long left coming in and fading out just in time to move over to the right, had it all figured out but the swell ended, ran out of lollols, so back to drifting, drifting. And yeh feeling shit at the start, doesn't go away.

Not game to proof this, says what I feel. Read Nick's next post, and pretty much agree, if you don't read through the lines above.

[Little]

Jimmy, can you please change your avatar, it really bothers me.

[crabmeat thompson]

Braithy the ASP has had a drugs policy for many years based on the WADA banned drugs list, but the organisation (pause for amazed gasp) has never taken responsibility for conducting the actual tests. That has been left to the discretion of regional offices and individual events. As you can imagine, this has limited the drug testing to less than a handful of events in the past 10 years: some events in France, which were being held with the aid of the French Government and thus had to do the testing by law, and the Margaret River event when it was Drug Aware.

Two surfers have been exposed as using illegal drugs under this wonky system. One was Neco Padaratz who received a 12 month ban from competition. The other, whom the ASP will not name, was caught for a recreational type drug and hit with a penalty that has not been made public.

The ASP is currently in the process of applying for signatory status with WADA which involves setting up a proper WADA-approved drug testing regime. This should be up and running in 2012. It will probably be a bit like the ISA's system in which all finalists and random other competitors are tested both in and out of competition. Yep that's right, the amateur organisation is about a decade ahead of the pro one in this regard. (Probably because the ISA wants to be in the Olympics.)

WADA's banned drugs list includes everything recreational as well as scientific -- except for alcohol -- you can test for that under their protocol but you don't have to.

I'm hoping that everyone who interviews Brodie Carr from now on will ask him about the status of this application, all the way until it is actually done and dusted. Because it's the sort of thing that might just go away otherwise.

B-Rad did good. Yeah he scooped me with the Billabong guys, but who cares, it doesn't matter who writes it, as long as it keeps getting written. Hoo rah.

In my opinion, it's critical the ASP nail this down and do testing and be consistent with it. It's hard to take a certain element of pro tour surfers serious ... when they aren't taking their livelihood and competition serious.

It would introduce an element of Professionalism

[kreepykrawly]

steve and olds, I have used illicit recreational drugs in major surf competition and they do not help one little bit
.

Boolsh-t..... I’ve had everything known to man...salvia,boo,crack,chop,weed,smack,pinga’s,oxy’s ect ect ect before a surf and I’ve BOOSTED !!!

Now all I do is have the occasional brewski and my surfing has gone downhill.

Seriously thinking about getting really messed up and burying a rail for old times sake.

[steve shearer]

I know for a fact that for a certain cadre of big wave riders.....a quarter tab is the optimum dose for surfing big waves.

And also guarana.


This I know.

This I have seen with my own eyes.

[purple pyramids]

Cocaine is the most fcuked drug in the world, i hate it. No probs with other subtstances, but charlie has never done anything for me apart from makin me a spaced out mess. And yeah ive done the good stuff. I spose my brain chemistry isnt suited to it or somethin, but i also hate being around ppl on coke. Turns you into a complete a-hole.

Surfin on acid now thats another matter

me too. it just means you suffer from borderline personality disorder ( i self-diagnosed myself last night).
it's the insecure narcissistic types (aka wankers) that find coke appealing. that explains why people find people who use coke so unappealing.
anyway, that's my ill-informed pop psychology take on it.