Sign, sign, everywhere a sign

[Beanpole]

Never see any enforcement on Bondi Beach of anything on the signs. Different with the parking rangers .

[WANDERER]

the locals will be above it

and there it is...

[grazza]

Leaving aside the issue of the sign jungle that is proliferating on our beachfront, and ignoring the uselessness of signs to control behaviour anyway, I personally think this will cause rather than diffuse conflicts. Since when were these the rules?)

Since the sixties grazza.
I don't blame you for not being familiar with them these days though.

Far as I'm concerned (and my Manly surf history only goes back to '71, so I can't comment on the sixties) it has always been right of way to the surfer on the inside. Farthest out? Waiting longest? That's just wrong - and totally ambiguous anyway. I will not be happy when someone justifies a drop in by the farthest out or waiting longest rationale. Surfing is a meritocracy, not some utopian socialist collective.

[Elmako]

I am sure they got some advice from a so called surfer to create these signs. We just have to find who this surfer was and have a chat to him in regards to the furthest out one.

But I think there is a great bunch of idiots out there that need to be educated surfing wise.

[Yuke Hunt]

Surfing Australia puts out a book called the Safe Surfing Program Workbook.

The Safe Surfing Program Workbook costs $15.

Here's what they say about it ...

Safe Surfing Program Workbook for introduction to the sport of surfing. Perfect to use as a model for Education Department sport programs.

Certificates can be purchased separately ...

Contents:
1. surf conditions
2. dangerous conditions
3. safe surfing
4. equipment for surfing
5. rules of the surf zone
6. marine safety professionals
7. surfers as environemental ambassadors
8. fitness for surfing
9. basic surfing skills
10. basic surfing first aid
11. basic surfing rescue procedures

So ... certainly the surf schools (especially at places like Byron) could incorporate some of this into a beginners course ... predominantly sections 3 and 5 ...(OK it'll never work ... but)

Now these signs that are causing such a rift in the space time continuum of the realsurf puniverse ... I for one have no objection to them being placed (with some thought) at various surf spots ... in an effort to edjamakate the uneducated ... I have seen variations of these along the east coast ... some freestanding ones in stainless steel surfboard inspired frames actually look quite good and in doing so draw attention to them and in turn create the possibility that they may be read and understood ... with the outside chance that the rules may even be adhered to ... if just a few people gain some knowledge from the information contained within the signs it has to be a worthwhile endeavor.

There used to be a big sign painted on the rock at the Pass ... LOCALS ONLY ... it worked a treat ... but its amazing how many locals there are in Byron ... mind boggling actually ... Sven and Helga ... and that 40 year old female lawyer from Sydney that Steve seems to have a mild obsession with ... yep their all locals ... the sign was changed awhile back in memory of Ben King.
I hate those locals only signs ... ugly and stupid ... just like the tools that write that moronic graffiti ... more like Yokels Only ... three fingered knuckle dragging mouth breathers.

[mical]

In the news section of RS - Surfers' Code of Etiquette

Manly Council Press Release Manly’s New ‘Surfers’ Code of Etiquette’ Signage

Manly’s ‘Surfers’ Code of Etiquette’ is based on a ‘Surfers Code’ developed by a NSW Department Sport & Recreation working group comprising surf life saving clubs, board rider clubs (both long and short), body boarding clubs, professional lifeguards, surf schools and local councils.

Apparently Nat Young designed the actual signs.

Maybe we need some of these as well?

Baby Surfer Sign.JPG (14.51 KiB) Viewed 3579 times

[mical]

Manly Surf School teaches surf etiquette to all its students. It is more likely that the beginner surfers who are in the way of locals are those who have not been taught surf etiquette by Manly Surf School. Many visitors to Manly often hire a board and try to learn to surf by themselves which can cause problems.

Perhaps when hiring boards there needs to be a leaflet handed out and hirer signs to verify they have read and understood?

[matt...]

Leaving aside the issue of the sign jungle that is proliferating on our beachfront, and ignoring the uselessness of signs to control behaviour anyway, I personally think this will cause rather than diffuse conflicts. Since when were these the rules?)

Since the sixties grazza.
I don't blame you for not being familiar with them these days though.

Far as I'm concerned (and my Manly surf history only goes back to '71, so I can't comment on the sixties) it has always been right of way to the surfer on the inside. Farthest out? Waiting longest? That's just wrong - and totally ambiguous anyway. I will not be happy when someone justifies a drop in by the farthest out or waiting longest rationale. Surfing is a meritocracy, not some utopian socialist collective.

i agree.
going by these signs some 40 year old female lawyer from sydney is going to argue the toss with you out in the surf, 'cos she was waiting the longest, or was sitting on her 9'2" mal 5 yards further out than everyone else...
are you for real, beanpole???
these haven't been the rules since the sixties!!
it's about respect for your fellow surfer - not being a total cnut, only a little one...
pecking order - as much as you don't like it, it exists
surfing ability - even TC wouldn't let a kook have the run of the place!
& getting on the inside by any means possible - or smokin' ya 'bra on the best swell of the year in 1983!
i was born in '70, so i don't know about the '60's, but i've been in the water since 1974 so i know sumpfing!

[RunamuckMalBoy]

[quote][/quotePerhaps when hiring boards there needs to be a leaflet handed out and hirer signs to verify they have read and understood?]

Just to put my 2 cents worth in... A Manly surfshop that i frequent regularly, which also hires boards out, has a massive sign where they do the paperwork for board hires. Whether people can read/understand it is a totally different story though...

[Beanpole]

60s i.e. pre shortboards there was no issue with mals cause everyone rode one. Its ironic that someones creditting Nat with these rules because I can remember Witzig saying somewhere that he credits Nat with creating the whole paddle inside the guy on the peak attitude that has become the norm.

I know it hard to believe these days and I'm sure you can quote some places where it wasn't happening then but this isn't science fiction. Its like people used to slow down at red lights and let people in to merging traffic

I don't say I do it all the time but it says a lot about the relationship of people in the water these days that it should seem such a crazy idea. Ultimately your saying unless you can outsurf me or at least match me in the water I'll give you no quarter and show no respect for your right to be there. Now thats okay for a grommett but try getting any respect from an adult who doesn't want your approval. To then turn around and say they have to abide by some rules that apparently you think are important isn't going to work. You can't expect people to be reasonable if you make it a one way street.

[Beanpole]

Double post there. Basically the surfs so crowded all bet are off these days. Nice to inject the vain hope of some common courtesy and mutual respect anyway.

[Trev]

No one is crediting Nat with the rules.
Yjey are crediting him with the signs which grew out of his infamous surf rage injuries at Angourie.
IIRC he used some or all of th eproceeds of the resultant book to finance the signs.
He may have had some input (may even have written) the contents but I must admit I've never noticed the bit about priority going to the person farthest out.
If it's there and I've missed it, imagine what use they'd be to a newbie.
Having said that I'm all in favour of the signs.
Every little bit helps.

[Chillin]

Being an older guy on a short board, its amazing how many people have assumed iv been surfing for 30years or more. In fact iv only surfed seriously for 4yrs. As a rank beginner you really have no idea of rules and etiquette, or pecking orders, what a drop in is, who is experienced blah blah blah, but you soon learn. Signs and leaflets or instructions will not prevent one accident, and lets face it what happened to that poor kid was an accident, from happening. I was hassled, yelled at, threatened with physical violence, lampooned, and all the other stone throwing that goes on when the attitude from out the back is "we're surfers and your not". Having said that, It seems to me that the problem is more prevalent when there is a large percentage of euro's who are trying to tick all the "we went surfing in Australia" boxes. That means they not only will not end up in the experienced group, but will charge through the lineup uncomprehending of the rules etc. and wonder why you are yelling at them. As beginner they cant understand why everyone else is getting waves and they are not, so they paddle to where everyone is getting waves after all, all they see is a wave with only one person on it. There is no solution apart from actual regulation of numbers in the water or maybe some kind of P plate rule where you have to stay on a foamy until the instructor at the local surf school passes you to get a glass board. Lets hope it never comes to that.

[Beanpole]

I guess the three ideas were more closely alligned in the old days i.e. if everyone had the same size board and you couldn't snake anyone then the person furthest out and who had been waiting the longest had to have priority. Simpler times I guess.

I remember a few years ago at the anonymous point near Taree it was 1 foot and there was one old ratty looking local out on a mal. I paddled out, said g'day and proceeded to paddle up the point about 20 mtrs past him. Got a wave and he chipped me about paddling inside him so I sat there and waited for him to catch a wave and then paddled back up for another. Still not that happy about it though. Can't please everyone I guess.

[matt...]

I guess the three ideas were more closely alligned in the old days i.e. if everyone had the same size board and you couldn't snake anyone then the person furthest out and who had been waiting the longest had to have priority. Simpler times I guess.

I remember a few years ago at the anonymous point near Taree it was 1 foot and there was one old ratty looking local out on a mal. I paddled out, said g'day and proceeded to paddle up the point about 20 mtrs past him. Got a wave and he chipped me about paddling inside him so I sat there and waited for him to catch a wave and then paddled back up for another. Still not that happy about it though. Can't please everyone I guess.

if some bloke is gunna sit 20 metres doen the line or wide of the takeoff area, that's his fcuken problem! if you paddle 1 metre inside him, you're a cnut, but if you paddle 20 metres past him - that's fair cop i reckon!

[PeepeelaPew]

...

[Surfin Turf]

proceeded to paddle up the point about 20 mtrs past him. Got a wave and he chipped me about paddling inside him so I sat there and waited for him to catch a wave and then paddled back up for another.

imagine adopting that approach at Manly ... there'd be a queue to the shore , up the beach, across the park and into the nearest cafe ...

[Animal_Chin]

In my recently completed studies we went over the effectiveness of signage (in a workplace) and its accepted that most signs will lose power after about a week. After that, no-one really notices them and they become part of the wallpaper.

But I guess in the sense of this thread that's OK because they will targeted at the blowin/tourist/nsp warrior who rarely gets to the beach.

So I reckon there's a place for 'surfing etiquette' signs on the beach.