Byron Bay Carnage

[Beanpole]

I agree with Steve. Places like the Pass, Bondi probably Manly too are so crowded with so many different faces that "locals" are often lucky to see more than a few familiar faces out there when its small. I counted over 100 guys and gals out at Bondi last week and it was a semi closing out sand splatting shorey. Didn't go out just sat down and watched the spectacle.

I often give a bit of advice to German, Irish, Scandinavian and Japanese surfers (not usually the Brazilians and Spanish ) I also tell guys surfing up the north end to go down in the surfing area if I'm swimming and swimmers to go up the north end if I'm surfing. A lot of people don't tell them but a lot of people don't move either. A lot don't move when the life guards tell them to on the loudspeaker.

How many times do you trim out on the shoulder to avoid people paddling out and they keep following you that way even if your pointing inside. :? :? :?
No way are they going to cop a bit of white water on the head.

At the risk of offending some female surfers a fair percentage seem to think advice from old blokes and also priority in the line up is a gender issue rather than a surf issue

Even if you can just make surf schools teach surfing in the white water without legropes the situation would improve slightly. Unfortunately they probably couldn't get insurance.
Funny they have a duty of care to their learners but no duty of care for the effects of the learners on the surfing situation.

[turtle]

^^ rule 1, when padlling back to line up stay to inside of surfers on a wave(its only whitewater ffs).

[marcus_h]

This thread has pretty much summed up my anoyances in the surf.

Paddling through the fucking impact zone on a point break is inexcusable. Its point for fks sake, paddle out and around. And if you do happen to find yourself there, dont try and race me up the face - just take whitewash on the head and deal with it.

Swimmers who fk around in the impact zone...just stupid.

I'm getting less and less patient as I get older (fark only 27 now, hate to see what i'm like when I hit the 40s!!) and have no hesitation to let someone know if they have done the wrong thing. I'm not a cnut about it just offer a little "advice".

My favourite from the last month was at Cotton Tree. Had a goat boat (not ol Kev...this dude was big, fat, pale and a chest rug Austin Powers would be proud of) give me a spray because I had the nerve to call him off a wave. "why did you cut me off he asks" as he tried to clamber down the face in front of me. Didnt know what to say..."back to brisbane mate".

[Beanpole]

I think the trouble with most learners and 99% of body surfers is they haven't mastered the concept of going diagonally across the wave themselves so they assume youre going straight in like they are. Even in crowded surf they don't actually know what theyre looking at.

Wait till your in your fifties

[Beanpole]

Paddling through the **** impact zone on a point break is inexcusable. Its point for fks sake, paddle out and around. And if you do happen to find yourself there, dont try and race me up the face - just take whitewash on the head and deal with it.
.

Just to avoid any confusion-thats what I'm complaining about not what I'm doing fellas.

[matt...]

^^^ sounds good for most points. i totally agree. if the option is there to stay out of the way - ffs take it. good point fellas.

however, a few points like avoca, where the takeoff is tight and is bordered by the rockpool, it is impossible to paddle around.
you have to get out of the way by paddling through the impact zone & into the lineup as quickly as possible, other wise you''ll end up in the rockpool, after being dragged across oyster-covered rocks. Seen it happen plenty of times, hell, i've even got a few scars on my feet myself from being caught inside when the point closes out on a big day. just ends in blood spill.
most people do the right thing though, avoca boardriders "elders" are supportive & nurturing towards the juniors & tend to "regulate" the point if necessary. robbo will fade ya into the rockpool! and one bloke yells his farkin head off, but that's just him.

so, most of us agree on this topic - who's gunna put it into action?
a few of us have said we are constantly educating newbies. i'll continue to do so out of necessity living in a popular holiday destination & constant annoyance of people getting in the way. how about it fellas?

[dUg]

I'd still like to see some workable, practical answers to the mass abandonment of ettiquette that seems to be the new plague threatening health and wellbeing in the surf.

Like many of you guys I speak to people, shout, bark, even swear when I believe it's warranted. I have "advised" people to surf elsewhere, and they have followed. On Sunday I was physically shoving the noses of would be drop-ins off the back of the wave ( again ), while simultaneously weaving between idiots paddling right through the fastest and most fun section my local has to offer ( again ). I'd never seen any of these dimwits before... I'll never see them again. Next time there's swell another 20 will replace them, and that will go on for the rest of the summer.

All the yelling and "re-neducation" in the world won't stop them coming. Sometimes I feel like I win a battle, but overall it feels like we're losing the war.

[ether]

Maybe the local boardriders clubs need to step up here. Identify themselves in the line-up (coloured/marked rashies or something?) and enforce a code of safety and general conduct. Ideally a national code, well publicised and taught at the surf schools. Things like paddling to the whitewater as mentioned in another post.

No disrespect to NC and others who have suggested having the 'elders' do this informally but I just think that'll be ineffective. The nature of those offending almost by definition means they won't recognise their authority. Someone we see as an 'elder' might to them just seem like some crusty aggrieved surfing bum who resents their presence in the water. The 40 year old lawyer in the line-up mentioned by another poster is a great example of this.

I know the boardriders idea is open to abuse of authority and I cringe a little suggesting it, but at least it'd be surfers regulating surfers. Local surfers too, who hopefully have a real interest in their own backyard functioning right. And if they were clearly identified, then the surf schools could tell their students to look for them in the line-up, listen to what they say, and to ask advise from them if ever they were in doubt about something (which learners are a lot of the time - I suspect they'd love to be able to ask advice out there).

[Clif]

Everyone should ride softboards! Safety first If you don't want to deal with crowds don't surf in summer I have barely been in the water except for a swim. Bodysurfing allows me to be one of the pests. If you can't beat em join em As RRon says, wait until the winter: bigger swell (when will it happen ) etc. Or move somewhere really really really cold (damn wetsuit technology). No amount of etiquette and training is going to stop these accidents. Looks at the roads and RTA education campaigns. Things will go wrong. The crowds are here to stay. Concomitantly, accidents are here to stay. Look for alternatives, be like water, go round the problem my children. Peace for all. Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Clif]

I hope the young bloke is OK and is back surfing ASAP. Always sad to hear when somebody gets hurt in the lineup.

[Trev]

ether,
the idea of "elders" advising in the lineup would not work if there was only one or two elders out there but there are normally more than that and perhaps if enough people tell "dorkfeatures" what they're doing wrong, they might get the message. Not all will but it's a progressive thing. Ongoing education.
The "lawyer type" would soon realise they had too many "witnesses" to be able to take any action.
However, the biggest problem lies with the dills who don't believe they're doing anything wrong. As someone else here said, people don't want to take responsibility for their own actions.
"Oh. Sorry" means they don't have to consider paying for the damage their idiocy causes.
The it's, "What's your problem? I said sorry".
I saw a case out at the Bower one day where a guy on a goat boat took off in front of 2 or 3 shortboard riders. One of whom colided with said goat boat, then fell off. By the time goat head turned around the guy who was legitimately on the extreme inside was right behind him. Goat boater then proceeded to attack shortboarder with his paddle for "running into him".
It took three of us witnesses to convince him he was not only in the wrong but had picked on the wrong guy and was heading for an assault charge. He went in very quickly.
And left the building.
Shortboarder ( a competent regular) had a small cut above his eye - luckily not serious.
But the point of the story is three regulars had the nous to stick their noses in and prevent anything more serious happening.
Goatboater was seen out there periodically afterwards but never transgressed again.

ps Great topic this. In the time it took me to type this, three more replies.

[marcus_h]

Paddling through the **** impact zone on a point break is inexcusable. Its point for fks sake, paddle out and around. And if you do happen to find yourself there, dont try and race me up the face - just take whitewash on the head and deal with it.
.

Just to avoid any confusion-thats what I'm complaining about not what I'm doing fellas.

Yeah sure mate...

[dUg]

I'd still like to see some workable, practical answers to the mass abandonment of ettiquette that seems to be the new plague threatening health and wellbeing in the surf.

....unfortunately dUg, what you refer to does not just relate to the surf. See society in general....

overall it feels like we're losing the war.

....as above....

The world she is a changing. Noone gives a fu(k anymore, and if they do it's usually with aggro and anger. Gives a whole new meaning to aggressive surfing!

Mmmm... I know society is rooted and I can't do anything to arrest its downward spiral, but I like to delude myself there's still hope for surfing.

[Beanpole]

Thanks for being so understanding Marcus

Theres no way around the crowds at places like The Pass and Bondi although I hate to put both in the same category. You can guarantee a fair selection of learners will be the same people at both places though living out of their Wicked Van all the way up the coast.

Theres a lot of guys at Bondi who probably consider themselves locals but the only people on the beach all day are the Bondi Rescue Crew (someone had a bad kneck injury there yesterday by the way). They should entertain the crowds with some educational lectures on the megaphone.

Some days like clif said youve just got to get out of the water.

[dUg]

the idea of "elders" advising in the lineup would not work if there was only one or two elders out there

There definitely seemed to be more "elders" here 20 - 25 years ago. I can think of numerous instances where people that trangressed were very, very quickly given a short, sharp lesson in attitudal re-alignment. Geez even I was on the recieving end of it very early on in my surfing career and I tell you what... I got the message pretty quickly and it stuck. Problems seemed like they were nipped in the bud back then - to the extent that people who looked clueless were pointed toward a spot down the beach before they even got a toe in the water. There were several breaks here that novices avoided, not because they were heavy or dangerous ( far from it ), but purely because they knew they would not be well received.

But now we are all so tolerant and PC actions like these are seen as territorial and agressive - they are not seen as a means of correcting unnacceptable behaviour. Ironically, we now should put up with inconsiderate and dangerous behaviour in the name of everyone "getting a go".

I find now the vocalisations are few and far between, and mostly isloated - seldom backed up by others. Divided, we have fallen it seems.

[Beanpole]

I reckon the only effect of this discussion is that some red neck is going to tell some harmless traveller to f#!ck off or bash them for no reason other than being in the line up. It will have no effect on truely overcrowded places where its a real problem.

[chrisb]

But no cops in the line up. God no. But yet there must be accountability from someone, somewhere!!

I'm not suggesting a bully-boy, sergeant-plod type of cop. I'm thinking more along the lines of an "air marshall" type who is invisible until they need to step in to diffuse a dangerous situation and have powers of arrest. The "cop" would need to be a dedicated surfer skilled in PR but willing to step in when it matters.

The candidate(s) should be chosen by Byron locals, ideally Pass regulars. It doesn't matter if the locals know who he/she is as they are not the problem, it's the blow-ins. I'm sure the locals could promote a "surf marshall" as a positive when marketing tourism.

Local Surf schools should warn their trainees about the dangers of surfing a crowded Pass and that they face detainment/arrest if their actions result in injuries.

The candidate should first and foremost be a competent surfer/waterman and would not necessarily need to be a cop at the start. However he/she should be provided with training and powers of arrest.

I wouldn't expect there to be a shortage of candidates for the job.

IMO The Pass is the most crowded and consequently most dangerous surf-break in Australia and therefore should be the first to try out the "surf-marshall" concept.

[matt...]

I reckon the only effect of this discussion is that some red neck is going to tell some harmless traveller to f#!ck off or bash them for no reason other than being in the line up. It will have no effect on truely overcrowded places where its a real problem.

every "harmless" traveller, or holiday surfer, has the potential to cause incidents like the one that started this thread
places are overcrowded alright! overcrowded with "harmless" travellers!

not because we're all PC these days, and all want to go surfing together like a big social orgy, but because people just don't give a fark and are ignorant of etiquette that may exist, or have existed.

we obviously do care, 'cos we're tossing around ideas on how to stop injuries in the lineup from inexperienced surfers. we can't just give up and accept it. it'll only get worse.