Do you reckon Starbucks pulling out of Aus is bringing home what people are saying as far as, When our Mining runs out we will be a second rate country with no ability to profit.
Is this the beginning of the end of the "Lucky Country".
They (Starbucks) State that Aus is no longer economically viable, With "Excessive Real Estate Prices" being one of there reasons for getting out.
My bets are on them hitting India big time, I think China will be screwed after the Olympics.
Are we Gonski's, Will we become 3rd world once the Mining and Resources are gone? Just look at our Diminishing Medical System, Petrol Prices, Housing Pressure etc.
Waddya Reckon?
Starbucks Gone
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Dunno about this being a general surf discussion, but it is an interesting topic.
I read the story a day or two ago and it stated that Starbucks were pulling out of SA entirely but leaving a number of stores in the other major cities. I think there is a viable market for coffee shops in Australia, but maybe 'viable' only in the major cities, where there is a growing café culture.
It's my opinion that cafés started slowly in Aus and have entrenched themselves, due to a few factors, such as a desire by the trendies to align themselves with the more fashionable cities, convenience, and an alternative to a pub. Coffee shops, on the other hand, sprung up to fill a desire and went through a boom period, the novelty of which is beginning to peter out. There is a definite market for coffee, I'm most certainly a fan, but it was overdone a little and now it's time for the accountants to do their dirty business. I'd rather the big businesses to pull out their stores than the small business owners to shut up shop. Whatever excuses Starbucks wants to use and maybe try to stick in the knife a little, maybe it's a bit of sour grapes. Though can't blame them for their reasoning.
As to the your other questions, I have no idea on that stuff and hopefully some knowledgeable others will add their bits. It's good to learn.
I read the story a day or two ago and it stated that Starbucks were pulling out of SA entirely but leaving a number of stores in the other major cities. I think there is a viable market for coffee shops in Australia, but maybe 'viable' only in the major cities, where there is a growing café culture.
It's my opinion that cafés started slowly in Aus and have entrenched themselves, due to a few factors, such as a desire by the trendies to align themselves with the more fashionable cities, convenience, and an alternative to a pub. Coffee shops, on the other hand, sprung up to fill a desire and went through a boom period, the novelty of which is beginning to peter out. There is a definite market for coffee, I'm most certainly a fan, but it was overdone a little and now it's time for the accountants to do their dirty business. I'd rather the big businesses to pull out their stores than the small business owners to shut up shop. Whatever excuses Starbucks wants to use and maybe try to stick in the knife a little, maybe it's a bit of sour grapes. Though can't blame them for their reasoning.
As to the your other questions, I have no idea on that stuff and hopefully some knowledgeable others will add their bits. It's good to learn.
1) Unlike the US we've always been able to get great coffee. Even in some of the larger cities in the US Starbucks was the first place ever to serve real, non-instant, non-percolated coffee. Therefore it was always gonna be hard for them to get a toehold in the market here.
2) To many Australians naming a coffee size 'grande' isn't a grand idea. Just a big wank.
3) Not sure about your further extrapolations of doom. I find it reassuring that Starbucks is going under. It shows that the model of business they use doesn't have a one-size-fits-all across the world. It also shows that there are still fundamental cultural differences between our two countries.
2) To many Australians naming a coffee size 'grande' isn't a grand idea. Just a big wank.
3) Not sure about your further extrapolations of doom. I find it reassuring that Starbucks is going under. It shows that the model of business they use doesn't have a one-size-fits-all across the world. It also shows that there are still fundamental cultural differences between our two countries.
Since the beginning of 2007 starbucks stocks have fallen almost 15%.
In addition to this when you consider a large amount of their assets are invested in the US property market, which is currently plummeting thanks to the sub prime mortgage crisis, add to that a falling $US, and a rising $Aussie, and I think you can expect to see starbucks pulling out of a lot of areas, and perhaps not just australia.
I highly doubt that starbucks will venture into india. Primarily because they dont now, nor ever have had a store in india, and to start now would seem a bit behind the 8 ball, which is not like starbucks. Also india is an economicly unstable devloping country (3rd world). Their recent economic growth is due to, but not necessarily limited to their booming population and the prolific expansion of their service industry of which 69% is via foreign invesment.
In short their aint a lot of Indian money in India, and the foreign money isnt always gonna be there, so i doubt starbucks will be investing in india any time soon. Also they drink too much tea.
In addition to this when you consider a large amount of their assets are invested in the US property market, which is currently plummeting thanks to the sub prime mortgage crisis, add to that a falling $US, and a rising $Aussie, and I think you can expect to see starbucks pulling out of a lot of areas, and perhaps not just australia.
I highly doubt that starbucks will venture into india. Primarily because they dont now, nor ever have had a store in india, and to start now would seem a bit behind the 8 ball, which is not like starbucks. Also india is an economicly unstable devloping country (3rd world). Their recent economic growth is due to, but not necessarily limited to their booming population and the prolific expansion of their service industry of which 69% is via foreign invesment.
In short their aint a lot of Indian money in India, and the foreign money isnt always gonna be there, so i doubt starbucks will be investing in india any time soon. Also they drink too much tea.
I have always made it a point to never go to Starbucks.
Big American corporates can fcuk off as far as I am concerned, I give my money to the small business and local chains.
Besides who wants all that syruppy, mocha-frappa-chino crap. Just make me a bloody espresso.
I reckon the reason why Starbucks failed miserably in Melbourne is that they underestimated how seriously people take their coffee down here. If you can't make a good cuppa you'll be out of business pretty quick.
Big American corporates can fcuk off as far as I am concerned, I give my money to the small business and local chains.
Besides who wants all that syruppy, mocha-frappa-chino crap. Just make me a bloody espresso.
I reckon the reason why Starbucks failed miserably in Melbourne is that they underestimated how seriously people take their coffee down here. If you can't make a good cuppa you'll be out of business pretty quick.
I dunno mate they lap up western capitalism over there big time. Admitedly I haven't been back since 05 but even back then they were guzzling mobile phones, fast food and designer labels faster than a European tourist on Orchard Road in Singapore.TMC wrote:I highly doubt that starbucks will venture into india. Primarily because they dont now, nor ever have had a store in india, and to start now would seem a bit behind the 8 ball, which is not like starbucks. Also india is an economicly unstable devloping country (3rd world). Their recent economic growth is due to, but not necessarily limited to their booming population and the prolific expansion of their service industry of which 69% is via foreign invesment.
but i work hard to be like a united states citizen ... sigh.
I don't know if Starbucks closing is the first sniffle in the viral chain that will see Australia regressing to a Mad Max style third world dust bowl.
There is still an awful lot of Australia to dig up and sell to China, India and whoever else will pay us.
Its not just Starbucks. Australia just does not embrace the whole USA 'chain culture' (in general).
The yanks can't get enough of chain restaurants and cafe's. In fact more often than not they would rather go to a chain than an independent outlet. They kinda like the safety of knowing what they are going to get everytime they walk into the outlet no matter what part of the country the outlet is in.
Whether it be Starbucks, Red Lobster,Outback Steakhouse, Morton's Steakhouse or fricken Wendy's.
In the USA Starbucks would be at the top of the tree as far as being an example of this. Its more than just a coffee. Its a 'Starbucks'. It probably also helps that the USA has the worst coffee in the world which makes Starbucks in USA look pretty good on the quality rating scale.
Take NYC as an example. It's not unusual to find 4 Starbucks outlets within 1 block of each other. All of them will be full most of the time. Frck go to Robson Street in Vancouver and there are two Starbucks outlets right opposite each other on the same road. Both will be full. And they say Canadians do not embrace the chains like the yanks do.
Bring that same coffee (even though the Aust blend is different) into the Australia market and it just doesn't cut it. They can't match the same quality at that mass level that the small cafe down the road can.
It's very simple. The Australian market is very different from the USA market. We don't like the chains and would rather support the independents where the quality and level of sevice is often far better.
As Rodney Rude once said. 'Now don't come here trying to change our culture'!
Now piss off Starbucks.
The yanks can't get enough of chain restaurants and cafe's. In fact more often than not they would rather go to a chain than an independent outlet. They kinda like the safety of knowing what they are going to get everytime they walk into the outlet no matter what part of the country the outlet is in.
Whether it be Starbucks, Red Lobster,Outback Steakhouse, Morton's Steakhouse or fricken Wendy's.
In the USA Starbucks would be at the top of the tree as far as being an example of this. Its more than just a coffee. Its a 'Starbucks'. It probably also helps that the USA has the worst coffee in the world which makes Starbucks in USA look pretty good on the quality rating scale.
Take NYC as an example. It's not unusual to find 4 Starbucks outlets within 1 block of each other. All of them will be full most of the time. Frck go to Robson Street in Vancouver and there are two Starbucks outlets right opposite each other on the same road. Both will be full. And they say Canadians do not embrace the chains like the yanks do.
Bring that same coffee (even though the Aust blend is different) into the Australia market and it just doesn't cut it. They can't match the same quality at that mass level that the small cafe down the road can.
It's very simple. The Australian market is very different from the USA market. We don't like the chains and would rather support the independents where the quality and level of sevice is often far better.
As Rodney Rude once said. 'Now don't come here trying to change our culture'!
Now piss off Starbucks.
that's bullshit! australians love chains and franchises. chains and franchises are everywhere you look in australia! we got bakeries and news agencies and t.a.b. shops and real estate agencies and sports stores all got the same name and look the fricken same! chains and franchises are a great australian tradition!
Wasn't "Starbuck" that cool dude in one of those space shows? He was around before the chain grew out of Seattle.2nd Reef wrote:^^ And they do have a ridiculous name. Can't we hold that against them?
I remembered - Battlestar Galactica 
And this is interesting.. Needs updating.....
http://www.starbucks.co.uk/en-GB/_About ... rbucks.htm
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Surfin Turf
- Harry the Hat
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Gee ... I just thought it was that crazy Avalon latte set that ran them out of town ... if only starbucks had included a chai skim soy latte served in a terracotta pot with a slice of capsicum and a twist of dill , in there range ...2nd Reef wrote:1) Unlike the US we've always been able to get great coffee. Even in some of the larger cities in the US Starbucks was the first place ever to serve real, non-instant, non-percolated coffee. Therefore it was always gonna be hard for them to get a toehold in the market here.
2) To many Australians naming a coffee size 'grande' isn't a grand idea. Just a big wank.
3) Not sure about your further extrapolations of doom. I find it reassuring that Starbucks is going under. It shows that the model of business they use doesn't have a one-size-fits-all across the world. It also shows that there are still fundamental cultural differences between our two countries.
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petulance
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In the new Battlestar Galactica series (Season 4 is currently showing in the US), the Starbuck character is now a hot shot fighter pilot, cigar chomping chick!TrevG wrote:Wasn't "Starbuck" that cool dude in one of those space shows? He was around before the chain grew out of Seattle.
You must of only got the single shot. Should of tipped more.smnmntl wrote:I was in Tokyo earlier this year and had breakfast at a Starbuck's - was the first & only time I ever entered their doors, but have to say it wasn't half bad. Had some sort of hot baked roll with ham & gruyere cheese on it, very fcuking tasty it was too, and a plain espresso (double shot) that any Sydney cafe would have been proud to serve up
Only time I've ever encountered really good coffee in Japan
The checkout conversation could have more robust & stimulating though
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